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	<title>Comments on: The Queen&#8217;s Speech 2008: the Lib Dem response</title>
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	<link>http://www.libdemvoice.org/the-queens-speech-2008-the-lib-dem-response-6707.html</link>
	<description>Our place to talk - an independent website for supporters of the Liberal Democrat party in the UK.</description>
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		<title>By: Ned</title>
		<link>http://www.libdemvoice.org/the-queens-speech-2008-the-lib-dem-response-6707.html#comment-72041</link>
		<dc:creator>Ned</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Dec 2008 14:39:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.libdemvoice.org/?p=6707#comment-72041</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s worth reading Lord McNally&#039;s opening gambit in the Lords debate on the Queen&#039;s Speech too. If only for the laughs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s worth reading Lord McNally&#8217;s opening gambit in the Lords debate on the Queen&#8217;s Speech too. If only for the laughs.</p>
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		<title>By: David Morton</title>
		<link>http://www.libdemvoice.org/the-queens-speech-2008-the-lib-dem-response-6707.html#comment-72016</link>
		<dc:creator>David Morton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Dec 2008 10:51:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.libdemvoice.org/?p=6707#comment-72016</guid>
		<description>99.9% of the population won&#039;t knit pick like we will (though the political journalists who frame media narative are in the 0.1%) however with that important point made I&#039;d make a comments. 

1. If Nick thinks our &quot;politics&quot; and &quot;economy&quot; are broken why do we accuse the Conservatives of &quot;sound bites&quot; when they say &quot;society&quot; is broken? Indeed why all of a suden have we pinched there word sounding like little Sir Echo.

2. Andrew is right about jobs. the political class is wedded to consumerist thinking and isn&#039;t brave enought to tell peple we have to move to a recession paradigm. VAT cuts are about keeping consumption going. The funded tax cuts for lower and middle income earners ( sorry he&#039;s changed it to ordinary now) are about keeping consumption going. Both are capable of being shoved in a shoe box under the bed.

We should direct any available spare or borrowed cash into making employment cheaper. Cut/abolish employers NIC.

keeping every last job is paramount. its not just that it keeps money flowing its an anti reposesion strtegy, its a mentalhealth strategy, its an anti crime strategy, its an anti xenophobia strategy, its a family cohesion strategy.

Its understandable that politicans seeking votes want to &quot;put money in peoples pockets&quot; to keep feel good consumerism going but its time for a longer term view.

Jobs, Jobs, Jobs!

3. The stuff on bank lending is populist and I&#039;m sure reflects real anger in MP&#039;s post bags. You ca put a hand on the tiller on the three nationalised banks but a government bank ? How long would it take to set up ? Would you trust civil servants to run it ?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>99.9% of the population won&#8217;t knit pick like we will (though the political journalists who frame media narative are in the 0.1%) however with that important point made I&#8217;d make a comments. </p>
<p>1. If Nick thinks our &#8220;politics&#8221; and &#8220;economy&#8221; are broken why do we accuse the Conservatives of &#8220;sound bites&#8221; when they say &#8220;society&#8221; is broken? Indeed why all of a suden have we pinched there word sounding like little Sir Echo.</p>
<p>2. Andrew is right about jobs. the political class is wedded to consumerist thinking and isn&#8217;t brave enought to tell peple we have to move to a recession paradigm. VAT cuts are about keeping consumption going. The funded tax cuts for lower and middle income earners ( sorry he&#8217;s changed it to ordinary now) are about keeping consumption going. Both are capable of being shoved in a shoe box under the bed.</p>
<p>We should direct any available spare or borrowed cash into making employment cheaper. Cut/abolish employers NIC.</p>
<p>keeping every last job is paramount. its not just that it keeps money flowing its an anti reposesion strtegy, its a mentalhealth strategy, its an anti crime strategy, its an anti xenophobia strategy, its a family cohesion strategy.</p>
<p>Its understandable that politicans seeking votes want to &#8220;put money in peoples pockets&#8221; to keep feel good consumerism going but its time for a longer term view.</p>
<p>Jobs, Jobs, Jobs!</p>
<p>3. The stuff on bank lending is populist and I&#8217;m sure reflects real anger in MP&#8217;s post bags. You ca put a hand on the tiller on the three nationalised banks but a government bank ? How long would it take to set up ? Would you trust civil servants to run it ?</p>
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		<title>By: Letters From A Tory</title>
		<link>http://www.libdemvoice.org/the-queens-speech-2008-the-lib-dem-response-6707.html#comment-72015</link>
		<dc:creator>Letters From A Tory</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Dec 2008 10:10:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.libdemvoice.org/?p=6707#comment-72015</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m still totally asked &#039;forcing&#039; privately owned banks to do anything.  If a government has majority shares in a bank then that&#039;s very different, but to force a private bank to do the government&#039;s will is getting into very dangerous territory (otherwise known as communism).

www.lettersfromatory.com</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m still totally asked &#8216;forcing&#8217; privately owned banks to do anything.  If a government has majority shares in a bank then that&#8217;s very different, but to force a private bank to do the government&#8217;s will is getting into very dangerous territory (otherwise known as communism).</p>
<p><a href="http://www.lettersfromatory.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.lettersfromatory.com</a></p>
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		<title>By: David Allen</title>
		<link>http://www.libdemvoice.org/the-queens-speech-2008-the-lib-dem-response-6707.html#comment-71994</link>
		<dc:creator>David Allen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Dec 2008 23:18:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.libdemvoice.org/?p=6707#comment-71994</guid>
		<description>Might this mean that those who shop at Tesco, Asda or Lidl are far too ordinary to be our kind of ordinary people?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Might this mean that those who shop at Tesco, Asda or Lidl are far too ordinary to be our kind of ordinary people?</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Duffield</title>
		<link>http://www.libdemvoice.org/the-queens-speech-2008-the-lib-dem-response-6707.html#comment-71993</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Duffield</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Dec 2008 23:17:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.libdemvoice.org/?p=6707#comment-71993</guid>
		<description>All good stuff - but we really need to be doing something to safeguard jobs. 

People in work are better able to survive tough times, maintain mortgage payments and keep the economy ticking with their spending. Government should be cutting taxes to support employment. Their temporary VAT tweak has just added to small firms&#039; administrative costs - assuming they have bothered to adjust prices rather than grab a bit of extra margin. 

Our plan to cut 4p off income tax is much stronger, but additional spending isn&#039;t guaranteed - the money might be saved instead - and it won&#039;t reduce business overheads. Jobs are already being shed. We need to help firms to reduce costs as a matter of urgency. 

Encouraging bank lending so that businesses can gear-up with more debt - especially to aid cashflow issues - is madness. The solution must be to reduce - or ideally scrap - employers&#039; NICs, covered by borrowing as necessary short term but replaced by a longer-term tax switch to &quot;value-removing&quot; areas in due course. And there are plenty of those readying themselves to rachet up again as the economy starts to recover - housing (i.e. land) prices and bank deposit creation to name but two.

C&#039;mon Nick - let&#039;s push to cut Employers&#039; NICs now, and put jobs first!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All good stuff &#8211; but we really need to be doing something to safeguard jobs. </p>
<p>People in work are better able to survive tough times, maintain mortgage payments and keep the economy ticking with their spending. Government should be cutting taxes to support employment. Their temporary VAT tweak has just added to small firms&#8217; administrative costs &#8211; assuming they have bothered to adjust prices rather than grab a bit of extra margin. </p>
<p>Our plan to cut 4p off income tax is much stronger, but additional spending isn&#8217;t guaranteed &#8211; the money might be saved instead &#8211; and it won&#8217;t reduce business overheads. Jobs are already being shed. We need to help firms to reduce costs as a matter of urgency. </p>
<p>Encouraging bank lending so that businesses can gear-up with more debt &#8211; especially to aid cashflow issues &#8211; is madness. The solution must be to reduce &#8211; or ideally scrap &#8211; employers&#8217; NICs, covered by borrowing as necessary short term but replaced by a longer-term tax switch to &#8220;value-removing&#8221; areas in due course. And there are plenty of those readying themselves to rachet up again as the economy starts to recover &#8211; housing (i.e. land) prices and bank deposit creation to name but two.</p>
<p>C&#8217;mon Nick &#8211; let&#8217;s push to cut Employers&#8217; NICs now, and put jobs first!</p>
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		<title>By: Clegg's Candid Fan</title>
		<link>http://www.libdemvoice.org/the-queens-speech-2008-the-lib-dem-response-6707.html#comment-71990</link>
		<dc:creator>Clegg's Candid Fan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Dec 2008 23:01:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.libdemvoice.org/?p=6707#comment-71990</guid>
		<description>&quot;Can someone explain precisely what Nick Clegg means by the term “ordinary people and families”?

What does one have to be or do to be classed as ‘ordinary’?&quot;

Surely it&#039;s not that hard to work out - it means &quot;anyone who might vote for us&quot;!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Can someone explain precisely what Nick Clegg means by the term “ordinary people and families”?</p>
<p>What does one have to be or do to be classed as ‘ordinary’?&#8221;</p>
<p>Surely it&#8217;s not that hard to work out &#8211; it means &#8220;anyone who might vote for us&#8221;!</p>
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		<title>By: Hywel Morgan</title>
		<link>http://www.libdemvoice.org/the-queens-speech-2008-the-lib-dem-response-6707.html#comment-71989</link>
		<dc:creator>Hywel Morgan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Dec 2008 22:40:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.libdemvoice.org/?p=6707#comment-71989</guid>
		<description>If the Liberal Democrats win on Thursday, I warn you not to be extraordinary.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If the Liberal Democrats win on Thursday, I warn you not to be extraordinary.</p>
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		<title>By: Ruth Bright</title>
		<link>http://www.libdemvoice.org/the-queens-speech-2008-the-lib-dem-response-6707.html#comment-71985</link>
		<dc:creator>Ruth Bright</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Dec 2008 22:16:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.libdemvoice.org/?p=6707#comment-71985</guid>
		<description>I suppose one handy measure is that ordinary families shop at Sainsbury&#039;s not Ocado.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I suppose one handy measure is that ordinary families shop at Sainsbury&#8217;s not Ocado.</p>
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		<title>By: Simon Titley</title>
		<link>http://www.libdemvoice.org/the-queens-speech-2008-the-lib-dem-response-6707.html#comment-71983</link>
		<dc:creator>Simon Titley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Dec 2008 21:55:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.libdemvoice.org/?p=6707#comment-71983</guid>
		<description>Can someone explain precisely what Nick Clegg means by the term &quot;ordinary people and families&quot;?

What does one have to be or do to be classed as &#039;ordinary&#039;? Can anyone here accurately describe an &#039;ordinary&#039; person? Has anyone ever met one?

Who does the term &#039;ordinary&#039; exclude? Why is failing to be &#039;ordinary&#039; reason not to benefit from any tax cuts?

Under a Liberal Democrat government, will the tax declaration form be redesigned to include the question: &quot;Are you ordinary? YES/NO (delete as applicable)&quot;?

And how does the term &#039;ordinary&#039; square with the commitment, expressed in the preamble to the party&#039;s constitution, that none shall be enslaved by conformity?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Can someone explain precisely what Nick Clegg means by the term &#8220;ordinary people and families&#8221;?</p>
<p>What does one have to be or do to be classed as &#8216;ordinary&#8217;? Can anyone here accurately describe an &#8216;ordinary&#8217; person? Has anyone ever met one?</p>
<p>Who does the term &#8216;ordinary&#8217; exclude? Why is failing to be &#8216;ordinary&#8217; reason not to benefit from any tax cuts?</p>
<p>Under a Liberal Democrat government, will the tax declaration form be redesigned to include the question: &#8220;Are you ordinary? YES/NO (delete as applicable)&#8221;?</p>
<p>And how does the term &#8216;ordinary&#8217; square with the commitment, expressed in the preamble to the party&#8217;s constitution, that none shall be enslaved by conformity?</p>
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		<title>By: Darrell</title>
		<link>http://www.libdemvoice.org/the-queens-speech-2008-the-lib-dem-response-6707.html#comment-71975</link>
		<dc:creator>Darrell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Dec 2008 19:52:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.libdemvoice.org/?p=6707#comment-71975</guid>
		<description>Not a bad show from Clegg at all...I like the &#039;broken politics&#039; narrative and think it&#039;s the right chord to strike...and he recognised the real possibility that the Green affair isnt making many waves with the general public (Brown has spotted this from his replies to Cameron) and tried to make it relevant through the broken politics narrative...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not a bad show from Clegg at all&#8230;I like the &#8216;broken politics&#8217; narrative and think it&#8217;s the right chord to strike&#8230;and he recognised the real possibility that the Green affair isnt making many waves with the general public (Brown has spotted this from his replies to Cameron) and tried to make it relevant through the broken politics narrative&#8230;</p>
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