I’m feeling quite nervous this afternoon. The House of Lords is debating an amendment which would give EU nationals who have made their homes here the right to stay. The Government is expected to be defeated and I hope very much that this will be the case and that we won’t have the disgraceful scenes we saw on Monday when the so called opposition were whipped to reject an amendment on the single market.
For me, this is something very personal – and also a bit selfish. Like virtually everyone else, I have friends who are EU nationals. They live here. This is their home. I don’t want to see them used as bargaining chips. My neighbours are from Poland. I don’t want them to have any worries about whether they will be forced to uproot their lives and disrupt their daughter’s education.
Those things are important, but as many of you will know, my husband was seriously ill at the end of last year. He is making a good recovery thanks to the excellent specialist medical care he received. The surgeon who saved his life and who sped back into the hospital at dead of night when there was a problem to operate again is Italian. He’s the same surgeon, actually, who saved the life of Nicola Sturgeon’s father-in-law. His registrar is from Greece. The nurse who looked after him in ITU so skilfully was also Italian. I want them to have the right to live here unimpeded for two reasons. First of all, it’s the right thing to do. Secondly, I don’t want to lose their skills which make Edinburgh one of the best places for cardio-thoracic surgery in the UK.
In our fairly lengthy dealings with the NHS recently, we’ve come across many other EU nationals – the health care assistant in the ward in our local hospital who was so kind and patient to all those in her care and whose sense of humour could always make a day brighter. I don’t have any relations in care homes, but many of my friends have, and they will be being looked after day in, day out, by EU nationals. If all those people left to live in their home country or any of the other 27 EU member states, then there would be a massive crisis in the health and social care sectors (as if those areas didn’t have enough challenges to face) . Sal Brinton talked about that in the Lords back in November.
Passing this amendment would send out a huge message to those people that their skills and the work that they do is appreciated and that they are welcome here. It also sends out a message that we are a country with morals which doesn’t use people as pawns in a political game.
As I write, Jonny Oates is speaking about the complexities over whether the NHS counts as comprehensive health insurance or not. He also said that he had been contacted by many British ex-pats who were worried about their future in the countries they have made their home and who feel abandoned by the House of Commons. They support the amendment under discussion today.
Earlier, Sarah Ludford spoke about the stress the uncertainty could cause to families. From the BBC’s live feed:
The Lib Dem’s Baroness Ludford has put her name to the amendment.
She recalls that last year, then immigration minister James Brokenshire said that EU nationals would not need to provide any documentation provided they had acquired five years permanent residence.
In reality, EU nationals are being asked to fill in an 85 page document she says.
The upshot, she argues, is “anxiety, dismay, turbulence” in people’s lives.
I have everything crossed that the Lords does the right thing. If they do, we all win. And if they do manage to defeat the Government, then they should stand firm during the parliamentary ping-pong.
* Caron Lindsay is Editor of Liberal Democrat Voice and blogs at Caron's Musings
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16 Comments
The important thing to do is to demand Merkel/Hollande agrees with Mrs May. They are seriously hampering her in getting the right deal for the UK which is to drastically cut EU and other migration for unskilled work while encouraging people like that doctor to stay here. Perhaps we will be doing deals bilaterally with Italy?
It’s funny isn’t it. We seem to herald EU citizens as some sort of gods working here from the goodness of their hearts like totemic angels as if they are on some sort of pedestal while many British workers have their own personal sovereignty cut. But then who cares about those 1m plus they’re only British having to sink or swim in the global eurocentric economy.
As far as I know the EU has refused to discuss the status of British nationals until article 50 is triggered.. Also we know, because Remainers keep telling us, that EU countries actually interoperated existing rules on migrant workers more harshly than the UK. So why on earth should we guarantee the status of foreign workers without a reciprocal agreement before talks begin? Also why only EU workers and why treat them as a special case if we intend to no longer be part of the EU?
IMO, this debate is not really about the rights of foreign workers. it’s about trying to string the process out in the hope that article 50 can be delayed until new rules kick in at the end of March.
Should read interpret
@Caron – ” It also sends out a message that we are a country with morals which doesn’t use people as pawns in a political game.”
I am afraid that it is too late for that since that is precisely what we have being doing. Even the most charitable/pro-UK politicians in the other EU member states will have spotted that long ago.
There seems to be an unofficial government policy of permanently posioning our diplomatic relations with the EU.
Many EU migrants are worried about getting deported, even if their immediate family is in the UK. The risk is that a two tier system of British people is created: those with a UK passport and those with not and even if those with not are not deported they are worried about losing rights: having to have private health insurance, as an example.
It is currently very hard to get a British passport. Marriage alone is not enough, even if it is demonstrably legitimate.
Even if EU migrants receive a guarantee, some might leave anyway because they feel they are getting treated like second class citizens even though they have been here for longer than five years and paid their taxes.
I know some people thinking of moving to Ireland. It’s also possibly family breaking stuff as new jobs need to be found in these places.
Glenn,
It must truly be a labour of love for you to come on here day after day to promote your illiberal views..
Perhaps I will start camping on the Guido Fawkes discussion boards!
Well played the HoL!
It is good to see a small outbreak of common sense somewhere in our Parliament
NO it’s illiberal to put workers that are not British ABOVE THOSE of British citizens. What is this obsession from the left with migrants and open borders? Again I ask why the left are more interested in unskilled EU labour above getting the 1m+ British unemployed people into work? The answer is that the unrestrained eurocentric globalist economic model is crumbling – and we are going to a more planned national model that creates a global economy that lifts up everyone.
What’s immoral is that the left have no answers for the British unemployed – what’s even worse is the dirty little secret that they just don’t care.
Andrew McCraig.
I’m a Lib Dem Voter. I’m just not convinced by the arguments around the EU. I think you’ll find around 30% of Lib Dem voters supported Leave. Never read Guido Fawkes.
Plus. I don’t think demanding we all stick to the party line is actually very liberal. I also don’t think relying on the HoL when you’ve failed at the ballot and in parliament is particularly liberal either. .
Well, as a BeLeaver, I am very pleased that HoL has voted for European citizens currently living here to be allowed to stay after Brexit, without waiting for UK citizens in Europe to be granted the same rights. I know ideally their situation should have been dealt with together, as spelt out by James and Glenn above, and this places UK citizens abroad in a weaker position in negotiations later. But there is no way the UK would ever deport the European citizens, so there was no real reason not to go ahead and guarantee their rights here.
I’m not sure I entirely agree with Paul about the UK being seen to use people as pawns. It has certainly taken too long, and it would certainly have drawn some of the unnecessary poison if the guarantee had been given earlier, but equally everyone can see Mrs Merkel (and others?) has been very overly rigid about this despite Mrs May’s offer. So, not great that it should come from the Lords when the majority of Leavers were in favour of the guarantee being given ages ago, but better late than never.
A national model that creates a global economy? You mean a tax haven?
“there is no way that Britain would deport EU Citizens” – really? How can you state that with any confidence? There are various reasons why many EU citizens may not be able to stay – more than a quarter of those applying for permanent residence cards dont get it.
James, I doubt Caron’s Italian surgeon or Greek registrar are ‘unskilled EU labour’. Nor is a French small business owner/employer friend of mine who has lived here many years.
You say ‘the left have no answers for the British unemployed’. I’ve no idea what the left have, as this a Lib Dem forum, but does anyone have answers? What are yours?
The idea that ‘no one cares,’ by the way, is usually the howl from the left against anyone who disagrees with them.
Alistair
I am confident there will be no significant deporting because David Davis said so in October.
A huge proportion of EU citizens currently living in the UK already have well over 5 years’ residence to qualify for permanent residence and, by the time the UK leaves in roughly 2 years time, a lot of others will also have been here 5 years plus. The country will have absolutely no interest in spending mega-bucks in deporting any of those with less than 5 years. Many commentators have said already it would be a complete waste of resources as well as politically toxic. There will be an amnesty for people in that category.
I completely take your point about the current level of rejections from the Home Office. They have been clumsy and insensitive to the point of unlawfulness. Some rejections are on minor issues that Mrs May needs to change the law on pronto. For other rejections, frankly, the Home Office needs to update its forms and its procedures. It is unlawful for them to be sending letters telling people who are lawfully here as EU citizens to prepare to leave the country. Someone needs to do a Gina Miller, crowd fund and take the Home Office to court over it.
Is anyone concerned about UK citizens working in the EU?
How does it help them if we guarantee that EU migrants can remain here and this action is not reciprocated? Those who advocate unilateral moral high ground should offer a solution to that possibility.
@james
“Again I ask why the left are more interested in unskilled EU labour above getting the 1m+ British unemployed people into work?”
How do you define “unskilled labour”? Which jobs are you referring to? Is it possible for any job to be ‘unskilled’?