Lib Dem Voice is currently running our fourth annual Liberal Voice of the Year poll. The purpose of this award since we launched it in 2006 has been to find a liberal from beyond the ranks of the Lib Dems — a Good Thing for a party committed to pluralism.
Equally traditionally, this has attracted some flak. Last year, it was Peter Tatchell’s inclusion which sparked strong views from those irate that the Voice should have recognised one of the Green Party’s leading lights. This year it’s the inclusion of two Tories — Ken Clarke and David Cameron — which has attracted some ire from commenters.
I’m unrepentant (not that they were my choice). By nominating Messrs Clarke or Cameron, or Labour’s Bob Ainsworth for his support for liberalisation of the UK drugs laws, no-one’s suggesting they’re fully signed-up liberals. However, their nomination does recognise that Liberals do not have a monopoly on liberalism, appropriately enough for an ideology that believes in the dispersal of power.
David Cameron is the most controversial inclusion, unsurprisingly. After all, he’s the Tory leader, a “Conservative to the core”, who wrote the party’s ultra-right 2005 election manifesto. And yet…
And yet, I think his inclusion is justified on merit. Not because he’s a liberal (obviously), but because through his actions he’s enabling liberal achievements. His critics — and they are legion in Lib Dem ranks, regardless of the Coalition — will say that for him these are an easily-paid price for power: that he’s simply following his ‘born to rule’ lodestar. Quite possible. But does his intent, his motivation, actually matter?
Put it another way: on 6th May, David Cameron had another option. He could’ve played along with Coalition talks; feigned commitment to genuine partnership; and then have walked away from the negotiating table, claiming the Lib Dems had double-crossed him, and made unreasonable demands.
Such a version of events would’ve been lapped-up by the news media (right-wing and left-wing alike: which is all of it). The Tories would’ve formed a minority government, and introduced an emergency budget which gave some tax cuts to the well-off propertied classes, and cut back further on welfare ‘scroungers’. They would’ve engineered a populist cause (perhaps over Europe?) to justify a second general election last October. And they would have almost certainly won a working majority. The Lib Dems — shown to be untrustworthy and unready for government, and with no money left to fight a second election — would’ve been squeezed mercilessly.
That’s what I think would’ve happened. And those who still, today, think the Lib Dems would’ve been better off out of the Coalition are in my view wholly wrong in imagining the party would be in any better shape in the polls, let alone that any of the major policy achievements of the past six months would have been achieved.
Yet David Cameron didn’t choose that option. He didn’t choose to govern alone; he chose to govern in partnership. For sure, with the Lib Dems as junior partners — but, then, that’s how the public voted. The cynical will say he chose Coalition because it was the easier option (really?), or because it’s the option which allowed him to make history (maybe). It’s more accurate, I suspect, to say that the Coalition is more simpatico to David Cameron’s own pragmatic, moderate instincts. Quite simply, it suits him better to tack to the centre than to the right.
That a “Liberal Consevative Government” (his description) exists is, in large measure, David Cameron’s personal choice. Does any of this make him a True Liberal? Not in my view, no. But it does mean his inclusion as a nominee for Liberal Voice of the Year is fair dinkum.
I still wouldn’t vote for him to win this poll, though. I mean, c’mon people, look at the list. There are many more far deserving candidates.
The poll is still open — see the right-hand column — and will be for a few more days… so vote early, vote once.
62 Comments
No, stop this nonsense straight away. Cameron is not one of us, nor will he ever be. He is a Johnny come lately who opposed all sorts of liberal legislation e.g. gay rights in the past.
Voting him Liberal of the year is ridiculous and will be used as yet another stick to beat the Lib Dems with. What was anyone think of, in nominating him.
Don’t vote Cameron. He should be removed from the list instantly. This is complete madness.
Stephen,
I don’t have a problem at all with Cameron being included per se for many of the reasons you state (although I did not vote for him!). However because of the FPTP nature of the poll coupled with the fact that there are only him and Clarke who are Tories compared to 8 other candidates there is a real danger that he will win because the votes for the other candidates will be split. I don’t know how easy it is to create an AV type voting system using the plug-ins available but I would suggest in this situation it would make a huge difference.
And aside from anything else given the referendum in may we should be trying to practise what we preach! 🙂
We have Lib Dem bloggers writing to the press complaining about the stories of an eventual Lib Dem/Tory merger, and the main Lib Dem website fanning the flames by nominating David Cameron (and I note he was top of the poll when I looked earlier).
It’s an indictment of our party that the list was very short of Liberal Democrats.
“The Tories would’ve formed a minority government, and introduced an emergency budget which gave some tax cuts to the well-off propertied classes, and cut back further on welfare ‘scroungers’”
Lovely to see the word scroungers being used to describe those on welfare yet again, And this time coming from a Liberal Democrat.
And people still think this party isn’t lurching to the right.
Nich,
The idea is that the winner isn’t a Liberal Democrat – it’s an attempt at displaying pluralism. Now I’ll be honest, David Cameron hasn’t got my vote, but he was nominated, and it would be cowardly to duck the challenge. And yes, it may well be the case that Conservative or Labour activists might vote for Cameron to make us ‘look bad’, but the joke would be on them…
Come off it Matt. He put it in quotes which is clearly indicating that is how elements of the right wing would have painted it. If you’re going to criticise at least be fair about it.
Nich, the poll explicitly excludes Lib Dem party members from nomination see (https://www.libdemvoice.org/whos-your-liberal-voice-of-2010-22534.html).
“Conservative or Labour activists might vote for Cameron to make us ‘look bad’, but the joke would be on them”
Gordon Brown could never see that he was a standing joke. These days, it’s the Lib Dems who can’t see it.
@Mark Thompson
Are you suggesting there are not ring wing elements to the Liberal Democrat Party?
The post was not quoting another person or party.
In fact he finished the paragraph and started the new with
“That’s what I think would’ve happened”
I think the analysis of what Cameron could have done is spot on apart from the tax cuts for the ‘propertied classes’. With another election coming up they would have been mad to do this.
Much more likely is the attacks on welfare benefits which have been one of the most popular of the government policies.
I suspect they would have engineered the election around something like the cap on housing benefits in London.
@Matt – No, I am suggesting that you are misrepresenting the nature of what Stephen wrote and ascribing an intent to his words that is manifestly untrue and unfair.
Matt,
It’s called irony. Look it up if the concept is troubling you, which it clearly is. And yes, there are some elements with the Liberal Democrats who are more right wing than others (whatever that means), but none who believe that those on benefits are generically scroungers.
And if you’re going to come here and slag us off, which you’re entitled to do, do have the decency to approach it with an open mind…
Oh, and by the way, Matt, why is the link from your name to Google? Hardly a mark of integrity, wouldn’t you say?
A golden opportunity for Tories to encourage each other to vote in our poll, and maybe Labour supporters will do the same.
These polls are a bit of fun and unscientific to say the least, but I think with this poll the laughs are on us.
Ignoring Cameron who the author is right did enable the coalition, I think it’s interesting that in a year where for 7 months there were Lib Dem ministers for the first time in decades that none are nominated………
Still I’m not sure I see Clegg as a liberal any more!!
@Mark Valladares
“And if you’re going to come here and slag us off, which you’re entitled to do, do have the decency to approach it with an open mind”
I don’t come here to slag off anyone, I come here to engage in debate, There is a big difference.
“Oh, and by the way, Matt, why is the link from your name to Google? Hardly a mark of integrity, wouldn’t you say?”
The reason for doing that was because, sometime ago on here, People were praising the Names appearing in Blue, as being a good thing, as it allowed people to skim through the posts that where worth reading, and ignoring all others. Some people failed to realise that having your name in Blue, had nothing to do with being a Liberal Democrat Member. It had nothing to do with Integrity 😉
Says it all really.
David Cameron Liberal?
Sell your servers now LDV. You’ve gone native.
@ matt
Glad to seeyou back! To have Cameron nominated just says it all does it not?
I know that you defend the sick and disabled which is more than any Liberal Democrat has done on this site. the word ‘scroungers’ should not have been used even in irony. We have to remember that the attacks on the sick and disabled by Osborne were applauded by Clegg, Cable and Alexander with patting on the back so they are totally complicit in this ‘scrounger’ mentality, have you seen any Lib Dem decrying this? What is worrying is the ignorance of Lib Dems on this matter. They seem to think that the ‘Harrington’ review has helped. wrong. The harsh new ESA medical test is still being implemented in March. All the review has done is to tell ATOS to smile as they throw the sick and disabled onto a non existent job market. The coalition also has not accepted the tribunal reccommendations, wonder why? Check this thread I was trying to get the point across.
https://www.libdemvoice.org/opinion-the-tyranny-of-the-state-and-my-conversion-to-social-liberalism-22553.html
@ Mark Valladares
Matt has a very great amount of integrity. Look towards the pledge breakers before you accuse others and where is the integrity of having Cameron nominated and even voted for. As for the link, that is probably because Lib Dems were decrying those commenting not in blue some time ago on this site, integrity, do not make me laugh.
Very thoughtful post. I think you are completely right, though especially your ending:
I still wouldn’t vote for him to win this poll, though. I mean, c’mon people, look at the list. There are many more far deserving candidates.
Hmm, I think those who claim that his inclusion on the list means that he must be a “Liberal” somewhat miss the point
And I agree with those who point out the difference between being slightly economically to the right of the far left, and believing that everyone on benefits are scroungers. My experience is that even those on the right of the Liberal Democrats have more progressive instincts than the majority of the Labour Party.
@Tom
It amazes me how the Labour Party are so villified and yet Lib Dems have taken on their disgraceful Welfare Policies with vigour. Why are they right on those but seemingly nothing else? i am confused.
Matt,
So. let’s see, wilfully misinterpreting Stephen’s comments is ‘debate’ is it? And if linking so that your name is in blue isn’t significant, why are you trying to imply credibility by linking your name to Google? To be honest, I find it easier to judge the credibility of a contributor if I can find out more about them, to put their statements in context. Are they really what they claim to be?
Anne,
Does Matt have integrity because he agrees with you? Or does integrity have some wider meaning? I fear that both are true. Contributors to this site were perfectly entitled to nominate whosoever they chose. Not all contributors are Liberal Democrats, nor would we insist that they are. We have our Members’ Forum for that. And so you don’t like David Cameron. I don’t like him much either, and I’ve voted for someone else. I don’t know who’s voted for him, and whilst I suspect that they are Conservatives for the most part, we’re a pluralist bunch here (for the most part).
It does worry me that individuals think that rigging a poll in favour of their man is so worthwhile (two can play at that game, and probably will). However, if you feel that we should exclude people that you don’t like, this may not be the place for you…
@ Mark Valladares
I think anyone who supports the poor, sick and disabled on here as Matt does has integrity, Unfortunately not one Lib Dem has, have you? You have been told why he started to put his name in blue, because of snide remarks and sneers by Lib Dems who dismissed anyone whose name was not in blue. it is obvious that you ‘do not like’ those who disagree with you but your suggestion I should not post here is typical. I think that Lib Dems may be worried about his inclusion as well.
I shall not vote at all as the whole thing is ridiculous as you will probably have many Conservatives and Labour party members voting just to pull you down further. Why do Lib Dems lay themselves open to such ridicule?
I was not wilfully misinterpreting Stephen’s comments at all.
I am sick and tired of people who are reliant on benefits as being described as scroungers, whether it is being said in Irony or not.
As Anne pointed out in her post, Few people have tried to highlight the plight of many sick and disabled people on this site. However it is a subject that to many Liberal Democrats are willing to shy away from.
The sick and disabled have been vilified by the Conservatives and the right wing media, The Liberal Democrats are in Government, albeit as a Junior Party, And yet none of them are prepared to come out and speak out in defence of these people.
Silence is ignorance in my opinion, especially when you have a duty as a party to be a voice for the poor, sick and disabled.
“why are you trying to imply credibility by linking your name to Google? To be honest, I find it easier to judge the credibility of a contributor if I can find out more about them, to put their statements in context. Are they really what they claim to be?”
I am not trying to imply Credibility at all, I have my own views and opinions and I am entitled to them. I already stated my reasons for Linking my name to Google, explaining that having your name in Blue makes you no more credible than any other poster.
And why should a poster have to divulge personal information about themselves in order to be credible? This site is a public forum, a place for people to have debate and express opinions.
Is there a repetitive and malicious troll plug-in for WordPress? There are some ‘contributors’ on here with far too little of worth to say and far too much enthusiasm about saying it…
Nich: I don’t follow the logic of your comment given that, as the post explains, the poll this year (just as in previous years) is about people who are not in the Liberal Democrats. How is thinking about who is liberal outside the party an indictment? Indeed, isn’t it rather liberal to think that not all wisdom or action is locked up within one particular party’s membership lists?
What we really need is a Slashdot like comments rating system; a means for each user to apply their own powers to filter comments to see the better ones and to sift through the dross?
I don’t agree Stephen. I think a Liberal voice should be a Liberal, at least most of the time. The list has virtually no Liberal Voices. Cameron, Ainsworth and Clarke are the worst of a bad bunch. Would Conservative Home or Labour List nominate a Lib Dem for their politician of the year? But go ahead shoot ourselves in the foot. The capacity for this party to eat itself amazes me.
@Anne
“I think anyone who supports the poor, sick and disabled on here as Matt does has integrity, Unfortunately not one Lib Dem has, have you?”
Thank you for your kind words of support.
Like you I am very worried about this coalitions effect on the sick and disabled.
I am extremely concerned that Liberal Democrats, seem to be to eager to stick their heads in the sand on this issue,
I believe they hope, if they continue to ignore people long enough, they will give up talking about it.
Well I will not be bullied or pressured into silence.
Not when there are disabled people who have been losing their DLA awards, And the appeals process is taking over 12 months in some cases to be heard. And in that time Disabled people are having their Motability Cars taken away from them.
I won’t shut up, when this coalition is about to remove the Motability Component of DLA for anyone living in a care home.
I can’t be silenced when this coalition, The DWP and ATOS are responsible for unfairly assessing people’s medical conditions With a Medical “Assessment” and not a Medical “Examination” and are finding genuinely sick and disabled people fit for work and throwing them onto a non existent jobs market. Over 40% of those who appeal are successful, which shows the current system is unfit for purpose.
However those who do appeal are forced to do so on reduced benefits for up to a year, whilst waiting for those appeals to be heard.
Lets also not forget that legal aid, removed from public funding completely, including debt advice, social welfare and employment, which will have a huge impact on sick and disabled people.
Mark,
It’s slightly eccentric of Matt to link to Google, but he has told us exactly who he is in previous posts. He is a Labour supporter who has voted Lib Dem in the past but would not do so now. Since Lib Dem Voice “welcomes comments from everyone”, why the hell go attacking his integrity?
Most of the so-called “Labour trolls” on this site make it pretty clear why they are here and what they want to achieve. If they talk nonsense, we should counter it with rational argument, not ad hominem attacks. Some of the “trolls” want to shame us for our many policy reversals and for selling out. They have a case. They might also look at Labour’s record in that respect, of course, but that’s a separate issue.
I think that every time a Lib Dem attacks the “trolls”, I can see someone who is showing that they are, indeed, ashamed of some of the things we have done!
Ahh, the joys of a democratic internet – there are always those who react to jump to preferred conclusions and ascribe baser intentions to opponents which they cannot possibly summise or attempt to steer the topic under consideration onto their own turf where they can plough narrow lines of attack!
I personally encourage all members of other parties to attempt to subvert this poll by voting for who they would least like LibDems to be shown crediting – tories voting for Bob Ainsworth and Labourites voting for Cameron would make for a refreshingly non-partisan approach.
Maybe an open poll will eventually provide balance among the opposing viewpoints, but I’d also suggest that it’s worth running a corresponding internal poll in parallel to provide an informative comparison – I’m prepared to bet that the voting patterns of LibDem members show a wider and less parochial trend.
*I personally encourage all members of other parties to attempt to subvert this poll by voting for who they think LibDems would least like to be shown crediting
oops.
TBH the thing I’m most annoyed about is that a poll by lib dem voice is using FPTP, surely AV would be more appropriate?
Well done LDV for running this ingenious IQ test, which most of the Labour trolls have failed. Despite it being explained very clearly that members of the Lib Dems are ineligible they persist in complaining about their absence.
I second the request for a concurrent members’ forum comparison poll.
Get Ryan coding an AV plugin? And get the recent comments tab working again?
@ Anne
“The harsh new ESA medical test is still being implemented in March. All the review has done is to tell ATOS to smile as they throw the sick and disabled onto a non existent job market.”
I Noticed from the Harrington’s review as well that they are not going to be reviewing and reporting on LIMA until 2012
LIMA- Logic Integrated Medical Assessment
The piece of software that is used by the HCP which decides someone’s capability for work
Even the guy who designed the WCA, said that ATOS and the DWP are not using the system correctly and are unfairly assessing people’s medical conditions and abilities, which is clearly evident in the amount of successful appeals.
The same LIMA software that even Danny Alexander Criticised whilst in opposition,
It is clearly not working, due to the high percentage of successful appeals. Over 40%
It is therefore irresponsible in my opinion for the Harrington Review to wait till 2012 to report on LIMA, And it is even more irresponsible for the coalition to go ahead with an even more draconian assessment as of March 2011.
The Liberal Democrats have a duty to the sick and disabled people to put an end to this
To be fair, the Telegraph did put Tony Blair quite high on their “top right-wingers” list recently – yes even higher than me. This is the new politics that you wanted isn’t it. Petty party tribalism put aside, LDV acclaiming Dave’s liberalism is the right thing to do.
Also since reading the other Matt’s comments, I have to say I feel ashamed to share his name. It really annoys me when people take a point of view just to be provocative and argumentative. “I am sick and tired of people who are reliant on benefits as being described as scroungers, whether it is being said in Irony or not.” So you don’t support the use of words to describe things? Stephen was clearly trying to show how a Tory mind works and not his own opinions. Even then, most of the time the word scrounger is used, it isn’t applying generally to people who claim benefits. It infuriates me how trolls refuse to acknowledge basic facts.
To be quite honest I don’t really have any idea of what ‘liberalism’ means any more. At least not in the sense of practice on the ground. The Orange Book’s ‘reclaimed’ brand of liberalism is not any liberalism I care for.
What Cameron did was, to my mind, pragmatic politics, not liberal politics.
To paraphrase the Guardian – the Conservative moment has arrived.
Anyway back on topic
Aung San Suu Kyi got my vote.
Anyone who is prepared to sacrifice so much by standing up to government is worthy of the title “Liberal Voice of the year”. In my opinion.
Cameron is no Liberal, nor a liberal’s hero. He is a pleasant enough narcissist, without any obvious grounding philosophy, much like Tony Blair and numerous other political leaders of various parties around the world who appear to ‘fit’ the present 24-hr-TV news age.
@Simon McGrath
“Well done LDV for running this ingenious IQ test, which most of the Labour trolls have failed. Despite it being explained very clearly that members of the Lib Dems are ineligible they persist in complaining about their absence.”
Personally I was being ironic as surely those Ministers that no longer follow, support, or even wish to be publically associated with agreed party policy should be eligible…
Well Davey C is in the lead… There have got to be more liberal people in the world than that what about the regressive VAT; the battle to keep control orders; the faster than wanted cuts; the keeping of trident; nuclear power; If you want a Conservative liberal look at Libertarian David Davis or give Ken Clarke more votes…honestly…
David Cameron had no choice but to go into coalition with the LibDems. Otherwise he would have had to helm a minority government. After the grim experience of John Major, the Tories knew that was an awful prospect. The idea that the Tories would have won a second general election does not seem to be supported by evidence. I can see no reason why a second election would not have ended in the same result as the first. Instead, Cameron has played an excellent move against the LibDems; the LibDems will lose whatever distinction they had as a party. Thousands of uncommitted voters (including students, young people, the poor, the unemployed, greens) will take their tactical or protest votes away from the LibDems over the next few years. Labour will regroup (as Cameron knows they will) and form a credible opposition that will pick up many of those who once voted tactically for the LibDems in order to keep the Tories out. A great move by master tacticians in the Tory Party. They knew that Clegg was vain and stupid enough to buy into the coalition agreement even though it will seriously damage the LibDem party. Clever Cameron: Tory Of The Decade.
Fair enough, Stephen – I was one of those complaining about Cameron’s inclusion but must admit you make a reasonable case. I still wouldn’t vote for him (Obama got my vote, FWIW) but I concede he has enabled a more liberal government than would otherwise have been in power, whatever his motivations.
However, I second the continued complaints about the poll being FPTP – isn’t there an AV widget? If not, I might try writing one… And the suggestion of a parallel members-only poll for comparison sounds a good idea.
You know you’re to the right of Genghis Khan when Paul Staines comes out in support of you.
Oooh, I feel unclean just thinking about it…
Let’s just spell it out. If you’d called it Politician of the Year, then maybe you could reasonably have put Cameron onto the options list. He has, after all, achieved a great deal (double entendre deliberate.)
However, you called it “Liberal Voice” of the year. Neatly positioning Our Nick as the ventriloquist’s dummy!
Stephen – Apologies for a bit of a semantic here, but I do think you need to be a bit careful.
‘Yet David Cameron didn’t choose that option. He didn’t choose to govern alone; he chose to govern in partnership. For sure, with the Lib Dems as junior partners — but, then, that’s how the public voted.’
Cameron chose to offer a Coalition agreement. No one was under any obligation to accept. And the voters did not vote for a Conservative/Lib Dem coalition. They voted for a Conservative Pary as the biggest party, Labour as second and the Lib Dems some way back. It is an unspoken thing, bit just out of interest I would have been very interested to see what a grand coalition might have looked like. The only people who have had a vote on the Coalition Agreement, as far as I can see, were the people involved in the Lib Dem triple lock.
Those who say coalition/new politics gives too much power to third parties do seem to have been in part borne out. I’m not sure it is that liberal to have a situation where the third party, not the voters get to decide the complexion of government.
Anne,
Your presumption that I don’t take an interest in the poor, sick and disabled is, to be honest, no great surprise. The issues relating to Disability Living Allowance are complex, and not really in my field of expertise – I do tax, bureaucracy and Suffolk. So I’m not going to start expressing my views on the subject because I am unlikely to add anything helpful to the debate, hardly an indication that I don’t care. In addition, I have a life beyond politics, so I dip in and out of Liberal Democrat Voice as I have time to do so. For you and Matt, this matters, and whilst I don’t know what your personal interest is based upon, I respect the fact that you care.
On the other hand, coming here and telling us that we don’t is hardly constructive. And then misrepresenting my comment as if I’m telling you that you’re unwelcome here is hardly a sign that you want to do anything other than attack us. Read back what I said…
However, if you feel that we should exclude people that you don’t like, this may not be the place for you…
We’re liberals, we believe in pluralism. We don’t believe in excluding people just because it might be difficult or uncomfortable. On the other hand, people who don’t share that view might be uncomfortable here, and they might feel more comfortable somewhere else. That doesn’t say, “go away”, it merely suggests that you might be happier posting on a website where you feel that participants share your views, rather than somewhere where you feel that they don’t. Up to you at the end of the day…
David,
I’m not attacking his credibility, I’m questioning it. If you click on my name, you get my blog. You can get a feel for where I’m coming from. Matt links his name to Google. He doesn’t have to do that, and he doesn’t have to continue doing that. I have the right to be suspicious as to his motives under such circumstances. I’ve had a bit of a dart at him because he has accused Stephen of believing that those on benefits are scroungers without any hard evidence. Given that I know Stephen, I know that he doesn’t think that, and that Matt is misrepresenting him. Alright, it may not be willful, but it looks like it.
Matt,
Nobody is bullying you into silence. Stephen has used irony in his piece, a point which you have either missed or overlooked. A number of people have pointed that out, yet you repeat the accusation. That isn’t debate, it’s an ad hominem attack.
A significant number of Conservatives think of those on benefit as ‘scroungers’. Actually, a number of people I run into who would never consider themselves to be Conservatives think of them as ‘scroungers’ too. That doesn’t make them right, but you do need to consider why they think that – mostly a lack of information is my suspicion. And yes, the system probably doesn’t work. If you set targets to achieve certain things, i.e. cutting the cost of the Disability Living Allowance, then those responsible for administering it will lose the will to ensure that those who merit it actually get it. Targets are anathema to the notion of dealing with people with thoughtfulness and compassion, unless those things are built into the target structure – and they almost never are because they can’t be easily measured. (I’m a bureaucrat, see, I know how that sort of stuff works…)
@Mark
I simply don’t get your “the joke will be on them” line.
They will walk away from the poll with us being made to look stupid. The joke is in us, I can see it, more and more Lib dems are starting to see it, some will refuse to see it until Clegg goes.
Some Tory or other has obviously directed votes here, though since they’ve already directed things within the actual party then this isn’t a great suprise. If David Cameron is elected Liberal of the year then the whole site will have degenerated into farce.
As far as this article goes Stephen, absolutely and completely wrong, in on sense at all is David Cameron, the right wing leader of the Conservative party a liberal and I think you’ll find that the title of the vote is *Liberal* voice of the year, he should not be on this list.
You still press on with your blinkered and in my opinion self deluding argument that this coalition is a good thing for the party, it may well be a good thing in a limited sense for those few with goverment jobs in the short term, but the polls and the the word on the doorstep shows it’s very far from a good thing for the party, unless that is your someone who’d be happy with a section of the party merging with the Tories after we get decimated at the next election.
I don ‘t think Cameron’s much of a Liberal, but I certainly agree to him being nominated for this award. The reason is that we are forever being lectured by people telling us how much the government he leads is pushing Liberal policies and ideas. I think these people are deluded or have a very limited view of Liberalism, but then this is just a nomination, not the actual award. If a significant number of significant people think Cameron is pushing Liberalism, then let him be nominated, it’s only fair. I hope he doesn’t win or come anywhere near winning, however.
The commentary on here is descending into outright paranoia. How many people have we had on the two threads on this topic declaiming the lack of LibDems on the list despite it clearly stating on both threads the aim is to look for someone outside the Lib Dems. It seems that these righteous guardians of liberalism aren’t as dedicated as to actually bothering reading something before they condemn it. How very liberal.
Claiming the end of the world or some right-wing conspiracy because David Cameron has been nominated is just as ridiculous. You may not like it, but David Cameron, clearly a liberal conservative, has been the major effort in dragging the Conservative party onto more liberal ground on issues surrounding homosexuality, climate change, multiculturalism, prisons policy, the NHS, International Aid and civil liberties among others. And in doing so has and dragging one of the UK’s two largest parties with him has probably done more to drag liberal policies and issues into the mainstream over the last 5 years than almost any politician, including any lib dem ones.
He has even, presumably unintentionally, by failing to quite secure a majority been crucial to getting Lib Dem ministers into government and Lib Dem policies into law for the first time in 70 years. That certainly deserves him at least an ironic award for liberal of the year.
If you don’t believe me then go to pretty much any comment on ConservativeHome and see the resounding outrage and fury at his liberal actions from the real dinosaur right-wing Conservatives.
If only the Thatcherite orange bookers realised just how bad this makes the Party look.
Alas! such powers of self awareness and facing up to reality are beyond them and with continuing talks of merger from Nick and his clique and Cameron and his clique it is hardly a surprise that this farcical poll is going the way it is.
Nick obviously fears he won’t be leader very much longer (he should know since he was so quick to put the knife into Menzies) and so the relentless toryfication of the Party continues with either a merger or Nick taking his Thatcherite orange bookers into the Conservative Party as the obvious endgame. Will he succeed before he is ousted ? We shall see.
How many will be supine enough to go along with this remains to be seen, but the ludicrous excuses for sucking up to Cameron here are anything to go by then even May won’t be enough to shake some out of their out of touch imaginary world where they actually believe Clegg is still an assett and not an electoral liability lurching the Party further and further to the right every day.
RE: comments about Lib dems
Personally I was being ironic as “surely” those Ministers that no longer follow, support, or even wish to be publically associated with agreed party policy should be eligible…
I think that the main problem with Cameron being included is that the award is called Liberal Voice of the year, I would take that to mean they have spoken up for or on a Liberal issue during the year. So Bob Ainsworth clearly is qualifies as a suitable nomination despite being Labour member as he spoke up on the liberal issue of drugs law reform In Cameron’s case can anyone recall Cameron uttering anything that could possibly qualify him for such an award in the last year?
Go on, vote for Call Me Dave: another nail in the coffin for the charlatans that sold your party.
‘ @ Mark Valladares
We post on here to get our views across to Lib Dems who may be unaware of what is happening in the real world,
That is the whole point and I can tell you do not like it We voted for you and feel betrayed and why we feel so angry at the Lib dems on the welfare reforms and the attacks on the poor, sick and disabled is that they appear to be standing idly by in silence. This will not exonerate the Lib Dems in the history books.. What has happened tp your ”Fair Society’? If ‘liberals’ do not speak out then who will? Who will be the next target group? You? if you say that we should be happier on a website that shares our views does that mean that no Lib Dem does on the sick and disabled issue? Now I am scared.
“In Cameron’s case can anyone recall Cameron uttering anything that could possibly qualify him for such an award in the last year?”
How about supporting liberal policies such as the pupil premium, abolishing ID cards, raising the income tax threshold, a referendum on AV?
Hmm, it appears that I was spot on in saying that some Tory or other has directed people to this vote. Since Guido Fawkes, who posted above, the libertarian right wing blogger has directly linked to the vote via twitter.
Considering the number of followers he has this vote is obviously invalid, It’s just ballot box stuffing and not a real reflection of Lib Dem Views.
@Oranjepan, @Andrew Tennant, @Catherine
There is a poll in the members forum:
(in two parts because the members forum can’t handle 12 questions)
http://forum.libdemvoice.org/viewtopic.php?t=3675
http://forum.libdemvoice.org/viewforum.php?f=3
Re. the public poll. I’m not keen on nominating the Liberal Voice of the year on the basis of public votes, because it’d be too easy for mischief-makers to rig it. This is something we’ve got away with in the past, because we were an opposition party. No longer. But maybe if the Liberal Voice of the Year were some combination of the public’s votes and the members’ votes, it could be made better protected from ballot-rigging.
And, if there’s an AV plug-in, we should definitely use it. But if no one has yet written one, let’s remember, the LDV team are volunteers, with limited time.