LDV post-conference members’ survey (4): what you thought of Make It Happen’s tax-cuts

Over the weekend, Lib Dem Voice emailed the members of our private forum (open to all Lib Dem members) inviting them to take part in a survey, conducted via Liberty Research, asking a number of questions arising from last week’s party conference in Bournemouth. Many thanks to the 187 of you who completed it; we’re publishing the results this week on LDV.

The big issue of this year’s Bournemouth conference was undoubtedly the party’s Make It Happen policy document, and specifically it’s tax-cutting message. So LDV asked: The party conference voted by a wide margin to endorse Make it Happen, including the line: “If there’s money to spare [after meeting party policy commitments], we won’t simply spend it. We’re looking for ways to cut Britain’s overall tax burden, so ordinary families have more of their money to help themselves.” This was opposed by some in the party, who said the Lib Dems should not place tax cuts ahead of public spending. Did you agree with the conference decision to endorse Make it Happen’s tax-cutting approach?

Here’s what you said:

> Yes – 61.9%
> No – 29.1%
> Don’t know / no opinion – 4.2%
> Other (please state) – 4.8%

A convincing vote, then, in favour of the leadership’s tax-cutting position, though a little less overwhelmingly so than the actual party conference vote (which was nearer to 3:1). Comments, as you might expect, divided into three categories: those passionately in favour of the new emphasis on tax-cuts those passionately against; and those either inbetween, or who thought the differences between the two positions had been rather exaggerated. Here’s a handful:

“Yes, public services cost money. But Labour’s doubled taxes in the last ten years, and everyone knows a lot of what they’ve done’s a fuck-up. If we can’t be at least 3% different to Labour, what are we all in politics for?”
“In fact, I don’t think there was a lot of difference between the two positions, a mere £5bn a year. It was the symbolism that was important.”
“I was quite happy with the fifty pence rate in 2005, but I think that the changes proposed are also a good way to deliver our objectives.”
“Old fashioned radical Liberal, not happy with the economic liberal slant”
“Your gloss is incorrect. We were concerned about the loss of help specifically to those who are too poor to pay income tax. Can two ex-Directors of Policy (Duncan Brack and Richard Grayson) really be wrong?”
“sensible, Liberal and popular (rare that any policy can tick all 3 of those boxes!)”
“Wrong policy, and defintely wrong time. Dosen’t add up either numerically or intellectually.”
“The best reasons to vote Lib Dem at the moment”

Part of the controversy of Make It Happen’s tax-cuts has been generated by the fact that the party does not, as yet, have firm, public proposals detailing how the £20 billion reduction in public spending to fund policy commitments and tax-cuts will be found. So the LDV survey next asked: As yet, the party has not spelled out the precise measures which will enable the party to cut public expenditure by £20 billion, and this has attracted some criticism within the Lib Dems and among sections of the media. Which of these statements comes closest to your view:

Here’s what you told us:

> It is not necessary or possible up to 18 months before a general election to spell out how this £20bn will be cut. It is therefore perfectly responsible for the party to state clearly its direction of travel – that it will reduce taxes and cut public expenditure – and to publish details before an election. – 47.6%

> The party needs to spell out far more precisely how it intends to find £20bn of spending cuts. If it does not the Lib Dems cannot expect to be taken seriously by the media or by the voters, and will deserve to be attacked as irresponsible by our political opponents. – 47.6%

> Don’t know / no opinion – 4.8%

That’s right – an exact tie! Here’s a little of what you said:

“I do think it is reasonable to say that we think we can find £20 billion without knowing exactly where it comes from. But I don’t think we should be pinning ourselves to reducing the overall tax burden until we have a better idea how much our key pledges will cost first.”
“I can’t believe Vince Cable hasn’t worked this out, so why can’t we see some worked examples, as with a Budget. What would happen if a General Election were to be called next week?”
“We can only really know what the true state of the economy is if and when Vince gets his hands on the books.”
“Not sensible or possible to be specific at this distance from a GE. But I hope that when we come to manifesto stage we will be really CLEAR.”
“”If £20bn is a definite amount, then it should be accompanied by precise details. If not, then the sloppy thinking which presents that round figure does not reflect well on the party.”
“A lot could happen to the public finances in 18 months and making concrete proposals now risks having to change them nearer an election and having the change branded a “u-turn” by the media.”
“The aspiration is a more important signal than the detail.”
“The economy is so volatile that we need to leave ourselves some room for manoeuvre. If we set out every dot and comma of policy now, we would only be overtaken by events, and good ideas would be nicked by the other parties.”

LDV post-conference members’ survey (1): why you did – and didn’t – attend the Lib Dem conference.
LDV post-conference members’ survey (2): what you thought of the media coverage of the Lib Dem conference
LDV post-conference members’ survey (3): who you will vote for in the Lib Dem presidential race

Read more by or more about .
This entry was posted in Conference and LDV Members poll.
Advert

11 Comments

  • Clegg's Candid Friend 26th Sep '08 - 10:14am

    “A convincing vote, then, in favour of the leadership’s tax-cutting position, though a little less overwhelmingly so than the actual party conference vote (which was nearer to 3:1).”

    But that comparison is quite wrong.

    The conference voted nearly unanimously for “Make it Happen”.

    The contentious issue, of course was the amendment about the relative priority of tax cuts, reducing inequality and tackling global warming.

    Why not poll your members on whether or not they agree with the amendment?

  • Clegg's Candid Friend 26th Sep '08 - 11:48am

    Stephen Tall

    Of course I read it.

    What I’m suggesting is that you ask your members whether or not they agreed with the amendment.

    If that’s the question you were trying to ask, I’m afraid you made an abysmal job of it.

  • Hywel Morgan 26th Sep '08 - 12:27pm

    Another c.£1.5bn of annual spending “commitments”

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7636990.stm
    “Sir Menzies’ paper contains an estimate from the Royal United Services Institute which suggests that the Ministry of Defence’s procurement plans for new equipment are now underfunded by up to £15bn over a 10-year period.”

    I’m becoming less convinced of how robust these plans actually are.

    And Martin – we’re already talking of 4p income tax cuts for the people your referring to without any of the MiH overall cuts.

  • Liberal Neil 26th Sep '08 - 2:51pm

    Martin – that’s not the same thing.

    It is quite possible to be in favour of the tax cuts for low & middle income households the party agreed last year but to be against going further than that this year.

  • Paul Griffiths 26th Sep '08 - 7:21pm

    CCF, when I answered the first question, I had no doubt that I was being asked about the amendment. What do you think I thought I was being asked?

  • Clegg's Candid Friend 26th Sep '08 - 7:44pm

    “I had no doubt that I was being asked about the amendment”

    No doubt people who had followed the debate closely and were prepared to read between the lines could work it out. But remember that most people wouldn’t even have known what the wording of the amendment was unless they were provided with it.

    If Stephen had wanted to ask a direct and fair question, why not simply quote the amendment and ask whether people agreed with it?

    As it is, the question could scarcely be more loaded. In effect, it conveys, “Nick Clegg wants to cut your taxes if there is money left over after we have met our commitments. Some people disagree with this. Do you endorse Nick Clegg’s approach?”

    Of course, that’s par for the course, considering the way the amendment was misrepresented by its opponents during the debate.

  • Paul Griffiths 26th Sep '08 - 8:03pm

    CCF, you seem to be saying that I’m better informed and more astute than most of the LDV forum members. Thanks!

  • The wording of the question clearly read to me too as being about the amendment.

  • David Allen 28th Sep '08 - 1:57am

    Martin, you are quite right about the way people often react to a dire situation. They clutch at straws. They want to believe the impossible. They fall for the promises of charlatans.

    As you point out, their mood can also become dangerously unstable. No doubt the menace implied by your comment “You will only need a single ticket” was intentional. Whether the comment was wise is a different question.

    Adolf Hitler understood the politics of desperation all too well. Those not in favour of Hitler’s populist remedies for 1930s Germany’s anxieties were also given, shall we say, short shrift.

    Of course, a simple promise to give everybody some free money (in the depths of a recession!) is morally a million miles away from Hitler’s promise to commit mass murder. However, the phrase “desperate policies for desperate times” does seem to apply to both cases. It does not make me proud of my continuing membership of this Party.

Post a Comment

Lib Dem Voice welcomes comments from everyone but we ask you to be polite, to be on topic and to be who you say you are. You can read our comments policy in full here. Please respect it and all readers of the site.

To have your photo next to your comment please signup your email address with Gravatar.

Your email is never published. Required fields are marked *

*
*
Please complete the name of this site, Liberal Democrat ...?

Advert

Recent Comments

  • Tom Bailey
    Daniel Walker, I'm fully aware of how the EU elective system works, and the point is that European voters are not allowed any direct access to that process. [ p...
  • Daniel Walker
    @Tom Bailey "instead of the white/black smoke system used to choose Pope von der Leyen" The President of the European Commission is nominated by the European...
  • Tom Bailey
    I like the sound of STV elections. Why not start the process by convincing the EU to use that system instead of the white/black smoke system used to choose Pope...
  • Matt (Bristol)
    Mark, I notice other comments have not made it and in truth there is no reason for me to derail this thread. But I genuinely believe there are a significant num...
  • Hywel
    Paul - what was this. It isn't on the wikipedia page of polls. Not surprised by the lack of commentary - the slow but noticeable down-tick in reform poll rati...