Sorry seems to be the hardest word for Mr Miliband

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59 Comments

  • Who is responsible for the LibDem video’s? If you are going to attack Miliband don’t show him looking impressive talking to an audience with nice music playing. It really is hardly surprising Labour are moving ahead in the polls. Three polls today showing Labour with leads of 6%, 4% and 3%.

  • The mystery is why the Conservative vote is 3 ,4, 5% below its 2010 level. However is that really right, the Ashcroft constituency polls have them doing okay with a rising vote in several of the key marginals. At the same time they report a steady and significant drop of UKIP support both in the Con/Lab and Con/Lib Dem marginals, yet one poll has them at 18% and rising today..

  • John Roffey 9th Apr '15 - 8:44pm

    “This general Election has seen some new lows with regard to electioneering.

    I don’t know if it is as the result of engaging Lynton Crosby & Ryan Coetzee as strategists – but Ed Miliband and Labour generally are beginning to look extremely principled in contrast to the Tories & the Lib/Dems.

    Some points may be scored – but the majority do understand what decent behaviour is – and are very likely to demonstrate what they think of these baseless attacks when they arrive at the ballot box.”

    I appreciate those on LDV, who are responsible for what is published on the site, are desperately eager to improve the Party’s results at the GE as I presume that once the the results are known [and the LDs are the 4th largest party] they will lose their jobs as a result of lower funding. However – it would be good if they could leave the Party with a shred of dignity as it is going to be an enormous task, with virtually no press coverage, to revive it after 7 May.

  • Caron Lindsay Caron Lindsay 9th Apr '15 - 8:45pm

    Well, it’s certainly better than Uptown Funk.

    It’s fun, but I think you can over-egg this “Labour crashed the economy” thing. They did spend too much, they didn’t fix the structural deficit and they, in common with every other rich government didn’t regulate the banks but they did the right thing when the banks crashed. I was glad Alistair Darling was chancellor then and not George Osborne.

    Where they can be criticised is for the way they knew there would have to be cuts and didn’t engage properly in that debate.

  • Helen Dudden 9th Apr '15 - 8:51pm

    You could say this is childish. Not providing an argument for a better economy. Getting rid of the “bedroom tax” and housing improved.

    Making sure “decent homes” are in place, not pie in the sky.

    I felt embarrassed by the above, like being in a children’s play ground.

  • Whoever is running the Labour campaign is head and shoulders above the rest. The LibDems used to be good at this – what happened to them?

  • Helen Dudden 9th Apr '15 - 9:15pm

    It would be a better idea to provide a sensible argument. Silly games are not the way forward for any Party. Actually I have sort of made my mind up where I put the X , I want to see housing, end the need for “food banks” being used the way they have become needed to support government cuts. Sick children sent to school because parents are both working.

    The above should have been considered.

  • Philip Thomas 9th Apr '15 - 9:19pm

    “The mystery is why the Conservative vote is 3 ,4, 5% below its 2010 level. However is that really right, the Ashcroft constituency polls have them doing okay with a rising vote in several of the key marginals. At the same time they report a steady and significant drop of UKIP support both in the Con/Lab and Con/Lib Dem marginals, yet one poll has them at 18% and rising today..”

    Very mysterious, given the UKIP vote is 12% higher and most UKIP support comes fom ex-Tories- Conservative vote should be 8,9,10% below its 2010 level. Presumably the movement from Tory to UKIP has been accompanied by a parallel LD to Tory movement- but not enough to completely stem the losses, hence the 3,4,5% drop.

    As for Ashcroft, he’s a Tory, and he himself coined the term “comfort polling”…

    @John Roffey
    I’m not sure LDV will lose funding. Firstly, I didn’t think the Lib Dems were getting any funding for being third largest party since that money only goes to parties in opposition. Secondly all opposition parties get some money based on vote share and seats. Thirdly, I have no idea how much this website costs to run but I should imagine some of the users would be prepared to contribute to cost.

  • Andrew Watson 9th Apr '15 - 9:26pm

    I heard my 88 year old Mother the other day say to my Dad, as she looked over a nasty anti -Miliband cartoon in the Telegraph, that she felt really sorry for Ed Miliband. As she is a lifelong Tory who, in my experience has never ever said one single positive word about any Labour leader or politician for that matter, this really brought home to me how these unpleasant attacks on Miliband are backfiring. I look at Tories and some Lib Dems and I can’t see much of a distinction between them. Miliband has grown in stature due to these childish tactics and has been made to look decent and dignified.

  • John Roffey 9th Apr '15 - 9:37pm

    Philip Thomas 9th Apr ’15 – 9:19pm

    “I’m not sure LDV will lose funding. Firstly, I didn’t think the Lib Dems were getting any funding for being third largest party since that money only goes to parties in opposition. Secondly all opposition parties get some money based on vote share and seats”

    I won’t pretend that I know Philip – but that the Party would lose a substantial sum – seemed to be the conclusion of those who understood these things, when it was discussed on another thread. However, the loss of press and TV coverage is nigh certain.

  • “Whoever is running the Labour campaign is head and shoulders above the rest. The LibDems used to be good at this – what happened to them?”

    What happened is they have just been in government with senior ministers in the cabinet. This means that this time they have to run on their own record this time round.

    Can’t just blame the bad bits on the Tories either, there is such a thing as collective cabinet responsibility.

    Once you’re in government that’s it. You run the next election on your record, the good, and the bad.

  • PS. The Ed video was cringe worthy, for it’s authors, not Ed.

  • Eddie Sammon 9th Apr '15 - 9:52pm

    Lib Dems are getting drowned out of the debate. We need to hit harder than this, without going into Michael Fallon territory. We need to offer a positive vision too.

    I’ll try to submit some ideas.

    Regards

  • Tsar Nicholas 9th Apr '15 - 10:10pm

    malc 9th Apr ’15 – 9:06pm

    “Whoever is running the Labour campaign is head and shoulders above the rest. The LibDems used to be good at this – what happened to them?”

    You mean, “Whatever happened to him?” But hush, he cannot be spoken of here!

  • I can the see the point of such a video – trying reach audiences who may not normally be engaged as fully as we in the political process – but I can’t deny I’d rather watch a video of Lynne, Norman or Vince setting out some of the positive things we have done in government.

  • Steve Comer 9th Apr '15 - 10:20pm

    I agree with Malc – this video makes you sympathise with ‘poor Ed!’
    And I agree with ATF too, why can’t we see some of the frontbenchers who have actually delivered in Government, like Vince Cable or Steve Webb rather than the Deputy PM who hasn’t!

  • paul barker 9th Apr '15 - 10:47pm

    Off topic but have we seen the first signs of a Libdem rise in the polls ? The last 4 days has seen a range from 8-12%, an average of 9%. Its too soon to be sure & it could be a temporary result of the Debate.

  • Stephen Hesketh 9th Apr '15 - 10:50pm

    Eddie Sammon 9th Apr ’15 – 9:52pm
    “Lib Dems are getting drowned out of the debate. We need to hit harder than this … We need to offer a positive vision too. I’ll try to submit some ideas.”

    Good luck with that Eddie.

    The only acceptable themes are: equidistance, anchored firmly to the centre, borrow less than Labour/cut less than the Tories, hard working families, Look left, Look right, then cross … oh and anchored firmly to the centre, borrow less than Labour/cut less than the Tories, hard working families, Look left, Look right, then cross … oh and … etc etc

  • Peter Watson 9th Apr '15 - 10:51pm

    At least “Sorry” is an easy word for Nick Clegg … https://youtu.be/KUDjRZ30SNo
    However my favourite spoof musical video has to be David Cameron’s Conference Rap: https://youtu.be/0YBumQHPAeU (Caution: contains swearing).

  • Simon Mackley 9th Apr '15 - 11:31pm

    Not at all sure that going negative is a good idea here. It’s one thing for Nick to go on the attack in the debate, as it shows him off as a fighter and challenges a lot of the ‘holier than thou’ stuff thrown at the party over tuition fees. To follow it up however with essentially content-free attack videos is hardly likely to increase the party’s vote share.

    What’s more, I think there’s a risk that if we go negative and personal against Ed Miliband then we’ll be seen as collaborating with the wider smear campaign being run by the Tories and the right-wing press – which is quite frankly vicious, nasty, and something we should have absolutely no truck with as a party,

  • There is no mystery as to why the Conservatives vote is below their 2010 level.
    a) incumbent parties lose support over their time in office.
    b) austerity hit some conservative voters
    c)some older voters have been reminded of how horrible they in the past.
    There are reasons why they were out of office for 13 years and why they couldn’t form a majority government in 2010.

  • Julian Gibb

    Much of the content is total rubbish. However, it’s a great campaign video for the SNP, makes you want to paint your face blue and start fighting the English – and I’m English! It just makes the LibDem video look even worse and I didn’t think that was possible.

  • Jane Ann Liston 10th Apr '15 - 1:17am

    Nick apologised for breaking the promise on student fees. I seem to have missed Labour’s apology for doing something very similar in 1997, i.e. introducing said fees after saying they would not, and with an overall majority to boot. Strange.

  • Eddie Sammon 10th Apr '15 - 1:52am

    Lol, thanks Stephen. I’ll try to do my best. I find the party always at least has an open ear for constructive ideas.

  • Amen Simon Mackley. Doing my GSCEs in Newbury, when the attack dogs (quite literally with the fox hunting set if anyone remembers) went for David Rendel, time after time he was policy driven in response. I joined the LDs and Charter 88 (not popular with some) because of that – thank god I’m not a teenager now.

  • So just when the public have decided that the Tory policy of ridiculing Milliband is distasteful and the policy has backfired….
    Typical of the ‘current’ LD efforts, “A day late and a dollar short’………

  • When did Ed Miliband crash the economy? The video doesn’t spell out how a collapse in the sub-prime mortgage market in the US, combined with bad lending by banks over here, was the specific fault of Ed, and more generally the Labour party.

    Also, why has every single Lib Dem attack video or ad that I’ve seen focus on Labour, rather than the Tories? Is there something you’re not telling us?

  • Everyone knows Miliband isnt up to much. Please can we have a piece on the new help to rent policy that presumeably was invented on the back of a fag packet – Nick really should give up smoking and take up a hobby that gives him a supply of larger scraps of paper on which to invent new policies on the hoof. Does anyone think “help to rent” is a good idea? I’m fed up with governmemt policies that encourage young folk deeper into debt.

  • Liberal Neil 10th Apr '15 - 8:16am

    OK – I wasn’t convinced by this until Ed Balls appeared on backing vocals. Then I laughed out loud. It’s not the best bit of politics ever but it hits at Labour’s weakest point with a bit of humour.

  • Peter Watson 10th Apr '15 - 8:16am

    @Alistair “Please can we have a piece on the new help to rent policy that presumeably was invented on the back of a fag packet”
    Just saw that on the news and my response is similar to yours. It looks like a scheme to transfer money from government to wealthy landlords that is funded by young people’s loan repayments,

  • Peter Watson 10th Apr '15 - 8:26am

    Back in February, Caron invited us: “If anyone finds any examples of any unpleasant, personalised campaigning from them [Labour], please let us know.” (https://www.libdemvoice.org/so-the-labour-party-pledge-a-positive-campaign-44489.html).
    This Lib Dem video doesn’t seem to be any less personal than the Labour “Un-credible Shrinking Man” video from a year ago, and Caron herself wrote an unpleasant article this week about a young woman whose only crime was to express a preference for Labour after the Scottish debates. In previous elections it felt like Lib Dems had the moral high ground, but not this time round.

  • Ian Sanderson (RM3) 10th Apr ’15 – 8:41am
    ‘Everyone knows Miliband isnt up to much.’
    They used to say that about Atlee too, but were wrong then and even more wrong in retrospect.

    I agree with your point, Ian.

    Althought the facetious part of my brain has just reminded me of the Bob Monkhouse joke, which he used increasingly towards the end of his career —
    “.. When I said I was going to be a professional comedian, they just laughed at me.

    Well they’re not laughing now!”

  • Andrew Watson 10th Apr '15 - 9:16am

    I now see Miliband is being attacked in the Mail for having had several attractive and intelligent girlfriends before his relationship and marriage to Mrs Miliband. Could it be that the non-dom owner of that newspaper has an axe to grind? Whatever next? Perhaps they’ll vilify his dead father or gatecrash a family funeral. Oh wait…
    Delighted by the inept campaign being run by Lynton Crosby but still not impressed by the way some people (there are very many decent Lib Dems, some of whom are speaking out here) in this party are aping the Tories. Never mind, as endlessly predicted by one regular poster, the Lib Dem surge has begun.

  • Ian Sanderson (RM3) 10th Apr ’15 – 8:41am ……. Some of the attacks on party leaders are so unjust as to even make many of their opponents uneasy……..

    I think what is making the Tories uneasy is that they have so miscalculated the public’s mood on such personal attacks…..I agree with your take on Atlee, who Churchill dismissed as, “A modest man with much to be modest about”

    In public, Attlee appeared modest and unassuming; he was ineffective at public relations and lacked charisma. His strengths emerged behind the scenes, especially in committees where his depth of knowledge, quiet demeanour, objectivity and pragmatism proved decisive. He saw himself as spokesman on behalf of his entire party, and successfully kept its multiple factions in harness. In 2004 he was voted the greatest British Prime Minister of the 20th Century by a poll of 139 academics organised by Ipsos MORI…..

    Milliband is no Atlee but “Brave Dave Cameron” was afraid to go head to head in any debate…. Milliband showed great resolve in refusing to be ‘railroaded’ into military action in Syria, by Obama, Cameron and Clegg; so, perhaps, Cameron’s reluctance might not be without foundation….

  • Nick T Nick Thornsby 10th Apr '15 - 9:26am

    Liberal Neil is spot on

  • “most UKIP support comes fom ex-Tories”

    This is a fallacy. UKIP support comes from many different places. Sure there are ex Conservatives, but there are also ex Labour voters, BNP, some Lib Dems, and many from “do not vote”.

    UKIP generally appeal to older, less well-educated white working class people from non-metropolitan areas.

  • Tsar Nicholas 10th Apr '15 - 9:47am

    Andrew Watson 10th Apr ’15 – 9:16am

    “I now see Miliband is being attacked in the Mail for having had several attractive and intelligent girlfriends before his relationship and marriage to Mrs Miliband.”

    Well, am I the only one to think it’s disgraceful that he hasn’t been out with a man?

  • Expats – “. Milliband showed great resolve in refusing to be ‘railroaded’ into military action in Syria, by Obama, Cameron and Clegg; ”

    Rubbish. Miliband reneged on the promises he gave to Obama, Cameron and Cleggies because he was more afraid of his own party than he was of them. And look how well Syria has turned out as a result.

  • Caron Lindsay Caron Lindsay 10th Apr '15 - 10:15am

    @john roffey:

    “I appreciate those on LDV, who are responsible for what is published on the site, are desperately eager to improve the Party’s results at the GE as I presume that once the the results are known [and the LDs are the 4th largest party] they will lose their jobs as a result of lower funding. ”

    John, you do know that LDV is completely independent of the party, receives no funding for it and its team are volunteers, don’t you?

  • Tabman 10th Apr ’15 – 10:04am …….Rubbish. Miliband reneged on the promises he gave to Obama, Cameron and Cleggies because he was more afraid of his own party than he was of them. And look how well Syria has turned out as a result……….

    Of course you’re right….After all, Iraq and Libya bear testimony to the success of Western intervention . BTW the situation in Syria is almost entirely the result of outside interference.

  • Caron Lindsay 10th Apr ’15 – 10:15am
    @john roffey:

    “John, you do know that LDV is completely independent of the party, receives no funding for it and its team are volunteers, don’t you?”

    Caron – I originally thought that was the case – but assumed some payments from the Party must be involved – once it became obvious that there was a serious lack of objectivity in many of the articles included.

  • Caron Lindsay Caron Lindsay 10th Apr '15 - 10:52am

    Let me just make it very clear. Your assumption is very, very wrong. Liberal Democrat Voice receives no party funding whatsoever and no member of the team receives any payment for work on the site.

    A site made up of Lib Dem members supports Lib Dems? Who would have thought such a thing would be possible?

    Heavens above, nobody else is going to tell our story for us. We have to.

  • I was one of the people who “misunderestimated” Cameron. I underestimated the extent to which he would fill his cabinet with folk of a similar background. I underestimated the extent to which being a little urbane and winging it is often enough in this shallow world. But… he and George Osborne didnt have a record in Government by which to judge him. Miliband and Balls have a longer track record. Labour were in power for a very long time, during most of which there was no effective opposition. All politicians are opportunistic but Miliband has left it extremely late in the day to be announcing policies like the Non Dom policy, which is not an anomaly which has just popped overnight. Miliband’s character is under attack because he didnt put forward policies for scrutiny all these years he has been leader, he didnt achieve much as a minister, and he doesnt come across as leadership material. He comes across as a market researcher you’d try to avoid on the street asking you what washing up liquid you use. If he had a leadership gene he would be walking into Downing Street with ease,
    I agree that who his girlfriends were is of no interest to anyone, I dont think it does him any harm to show he is a human. He just isnt a human I would pick for the most difficult job in the UK

  • Simon McGrath 10th Apr '15 - 10:55am

    @John Roffey
    I would hope LDV is not objective – it does not pretend to be a politically neutral website but is supporting the Lib Dem Party and Lib Dem values.
    By the way after the election -if we are not in coalition- we will get the Short money back so your (offensive) premise is nonsense.

  • Caron Lindsay 10th Apr ’15 – 10:52am
    “Let me just make it very clear. Your assumption is very, very wrong. Liberal Democrat Voice receives no party funding whatsoever and no member of the team receives any payment for work on the site.

    A site made up of Lib Dem members supports Lib Dems? Who would have thought such a thing would be possible?

    Heavens above, nobody else is going to tell our story for us. We have to.”

    Does the truth no longer have any currency?

  • Simon McGrath 10th Apr ’15 – 10:55am

    “I would hope LDV is not objective – it does not pretend to be a politically neutral website but is supporting the Lib Dem Party and Lib Dem values.
    By the way after the election -if we are not in coalition- we will get the Short money back so your (offensive) premise is nonsense.”

    I have long known that objectivity, or truth, had little attraction for you Simon – demonstrated by the omission from your post of my clear statement that I had no idea what was the case [therefore not MY ‘offensive’ premise]. I had simply relied on those who had said that the Party would lose substantial sums, on another thread, if it were the 4th largest party and not in coalition government – which is presently looking the most likely outcome.

  • Nick Clegg’s accusation was and is sensationalist nonsense parroting Osborne & Cameron. None of the three saw the International banking collapse coming and Milliband wasn’t responsible for it and all three of them know it.
    Clegg, on the other hand had candidate sign a pledge not to vote for an increase in Tuition fees if elected. There is a fundamental difference between an undeliverable manifesto promise and a signed pledge which he seems to gloss over. It dishonoured our party and polluted the public view of politics

  • Expats – so you concede that Miliband’s “great resolve” was being marginally less scared of Obama than Diane Abbott?

  • Tabman 10th Apr ’15 – 12:40pm ……Expats – so you concede that Miliband’s “great resolve” was being marginally less scared of Obama than Diane Abbott?………………..

    Oh, dear!

  • Expats – http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/general-election-2015/politics-blog/11499438/Ed-Miliband-is-peddling-a-lie-about-his-volte-face-on-Syria.html

    “This is the truth about what Ed Miliband did over Syria. He did indeed walk into “a room” to meet David Cameron – it was the Prime Minister’s study in Downing Street. He told David Cameron that he would be prepared to support military action in Syria. He said that the Labour party would need some persuading over the issue, and because of that he would need to win some concessions that he could present to his MPs.

    Over the following days the nature of these concessions changed. First Miliband told Cameron he would need to publish legal advice showing military action was legitimate. Cameron agreed. Then Miliband told Cameron he would need to publish the intelligence showing the Assad regime had used chemical weapons. Cameron agreed. Then he said Cameron would need to demonstrate military action had UN approval. Again Cameron agreed, and confirmed he would be submitting a motion to the P5 to that effect. Then Ed Miliband said a vote would have to await the formal publication of the UN weapons inspectors reports into the attacks. Cameron agreed. Finally, Miliband said there would have to be not one but two Commons votes before action could be authorised. And again, the Prime Minister agreed.

    Whilst this was going, both Downing Street and members of the shadow cabinet began to have concerns over Miliband’s intentions over the vote. I was contacted by people on both sides who were close to the ongoing discussions. Downing Street were unsure precisely what was going on. The shadow cabinet sources were very clear what was going on. The Labour whips had been told there would be a significant backbench rebellion if Miliband supported military action. At the same time, Miliband was being warned by a number of senior advisers that he risked a reaction from Labour supporters, in particular, former Lib Dems who had recently switched allegiance.

    It was on that basis, and that basis alone, that Ed Miliband decided to vote against the Government. It was not an act of principle. It was not an act of strength. It was an act of political calculation and opportunism born out of political weakness. Stand up to Barack Obama or Vladimir Putin? Ed Miliband wouldn’t stand up to Diane Abbott. “

  • A LibDem quoting the Daily Torygraph as an ‘honest broker’ for Milliband???????

    The words, “Now I’ve seen it all”, come to mind”

  • Expats. So you’re saying it’s not true?

  • Philip Thomas 10th Apr '15 - 8:21pm

    @Tabman
    Ok, I’ll amend that to “the political party from whom the greatest number of UKIP supporters come is the Tories” (although I suspect that number is quite close to 50%).

  • Philip Thomas 10th Apr '15 - 10:02pm

    Help to rent policy: I work for an organisation helping homeless people: one of the biggest obstacles to obtaining housing is the lack of money for a deposit- therefore I cautiously welcome this idea of interest-free loans to cover deposits- perhaps the details need to be fleshed out, but I think it is worth exploring.

  • Tabman 10th Apr ’15 – 7:27pm ……Expats. So you’re saying it’s not true?…….In a word, Yes!

    Even Clegg distanced himself from the Downing street claims…. As the BBC reported….”Mr Clegg’s refusal to criticise Mr Miliband appeared to put him at odds with Defence Secretary Philip Hammond, who earlier stood by claims the Labour leader was giving “succour” to Assad…..

    Still you stick with the Tory (Telegraph) version….

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