36 Comments

• RICHARD MORRIS 21st Nov '14 - 8:32pm

  While the results look generally great, can i just say how sorry I am to see David Williams hasn’t been re elected to FE; a fine man and a fine Liberal Democrat

• Jonathan Brown 21st Nov '14 - 8:52pm

  Did the requirement for 1/3rd of elected reps to be women not apply to the IRC and ALDE delegation?

  Congratulations to everyone who was elected anyway!

• Laura Gordon 21st Nov '14 - 8:54pm

  Is there a problem with the FCC results? The top two not elected have higher totals than the bottom two elected…

• Gareth Epps 21st Nov '14 - 9:21pm

  Thanks for your support!

  The full results will show the transfers and answer Laura’s question: will Colin Rosenstiel be publishing them as he has done for a long time now?

• Sarah Noble 21st Nov '14 - 9:39pm

  Laura: looking at the vote summary, Sandra got a lot of lower preferences compared to Joe meaning that, in the end, she beat out Joe by half a vote.

• Duncan Brack 21st Nov '14 - 10:00pm

  Jonathan is right – the one third rule applies to all committees; and conference deleted the requirement for double the number of candidates of the gender in question, so I think the results for IRC and ALDE are wrong.

  Incidentally, it’s worth noting that the FCC and FPC elections both resulted in a majority of women – I think that’s a first for the FPC, though not the FCC.

• Richard Fagence 21st Nov '14 - 10:09pm

  Would someone like to comment on the number of spoiled papers declared on the party website? There is something going on here, I think. Federal Executive: Total valid votes 677, spoiled 13. Federal Policy Committee: Total Valid votes 656, spoiled 34. Federal Conference Committee: Total valid votes 642, spoiled 48. ALDE Delegation: Total valid votes 608, spoiled 82(!) What constitutes a “spoiled vote”? I would have thought that the electorate – Federal Conference Representatives – were about as sophisticated as it was possible to find within the party. Anyone like to explain this to me – and others? And I do hope Colin Rosenstiel will publish the results breakdown as he has before.

• Hywel 21st Nov '14 - 10:40pm

  I think a spoiled ballot is one that isn’t completed. AIUI not uncommon with ALDE delegation as people don’t really know what it is (or think it is some off shoot of ALDC as I was once asked!)

• Enlight_bystand 21st Nov '14 - 11:23pm

  Richard – all those numbers add to 690. I’m guessing that logging into the ERS site for the vote counted as submitting a ballot for all the elections. Of those 690, 13 didn’t click on submit for the FE ballot, 34 didn’t for FPC etc.

  I know for example on IRC &ALDE I’ll be counted as a ‘spoiled ballot’ as I didn’t vote in them.

• Martin Tod 22nd Nov '14 - 12:01am

  @Duncan Of the 42 places of FPC, FCC and FE, 21 are men and 21 are women. If you count individuals (since some people were elected to two committees), I think it’s 19 men and 20 women .

• Amalric 22nd Nov '14 - 12:18am

  Were the English Party elections also counted today? If so have the results been announced? If so what were they?

• Colin Rosenstiel 22nd Nov '14 - 1:25am

  The full results are now at http://www.rosenstiel.co.uk/ldelections.
  In answer to Jonathan Brown: 1 in 5 is one third (rounded down).
  Laura Gordon: the figures are first preference votes only. See the full results for explanation why that was not enough for election.
  Duncan Brack: the ALDE election is not in the constitution so has never had gender balance rules. It has had state party and under-26 balance rules but this example shows why the twice as many candidates rule is needed. The Scottish and (in particular) Welsh candidates get free rides if the rule is not applied. It appears to be academic anyway as the EU election results will shortly result in a drastic loss of places on this body.
  Richard Fagence: all the spoilt papers were wholly blank. In the online ballot, any ballots not attempted are recorded as blank..
  Amalric: The English results will follow shortly. The only result so far revealed is that Anthony Hook has been elected to the FE.

• Amalric 22nd Nov '14 - 2:31am

  @ Colin Rosenstiel
  I had hoped that the reason Antony had withdrawn from the FE election was because he had been elected by the English Party.

• Tony Dawson 22nd Nov '14 - 7:19am

  The big questions are:

  “Do we now have a Federal Executive which will finally hold the parliamentary ‘leadership’ to account?”

  “Do we now have a FPC which will insist on a decent policy agenda to put into the Manifesto which goes beyond ‘coalition plus’?”

• JohnTilley 22nd Nov '14 - 7:51am

  Tony Dawson asks two good questions.
  I think I am right in remembering that the elected members of committees are not necessarily the only members of those committees.

  Can anyone remind me how many other people wind up as voting members of the Federal Executive ?

  Are the 15 elected members of the Federal Executive a majority of that committee ?

• Simon 22nd Nov '14 - 9:12am

  There are 15 members of FE and FPC. There are 14 members elected by other groups. Including the party leader and president elected by all members, state party reps elected by the states mechanisms (Scotland already as omov I believe) and reps for the parliamentary parties and councillors. So the other 14 have all been elected by somebody.

• Duncan Brack 22nd Nov '14 - 9:46am

  Colin – I know the IRC and ALDE delegation aren’t in the constitution, but the motion at conference didn’t amend the constitution – it set rules for this year’s elections only. The relevant part is:

  ‘Conference nevertheless supports the principle of gender quotas and resolves to introduce for the directly elected components of all committees and other bodies elected by conference representatives in 2014 the following provision: Not less than one third or, if one third is not a whole number, the whole number nearest to but not exceeding one third (‘the specified number’) shall be men and women respectively.’

  I think ‘other bodies elected by conference representatives in 2014’ is pretty clear …

• David wilkinson 22nd Nov '14 - 9:54am

  Sorry to say none of these elections matter, the real one that matters is the one next May when Clegg leads what’s left of his party to destruction.

• theakes 22nd Nov '14 - 10:28am

  Does anyone know how many voting papers were sent out and what was the % of members who voted?

• R Uduwerage-Perera 22nd Nov '14 - 11:08am

  Interesting times with many changes and a significant number of the ‘Old Guard’ retired off!

• Mark Valladares 22nd Nov '14 - 11:11am

  @ Duncan Brack,

  I think that you’ll find that the specified numbers for ALDE and IRC are two and one respectively, based on the text of the motion passed at Conference. And, as there are two women (Ruth and Belinda) elected to ALDE, and one woman elected to IRC (Merlene), the requirement is satisfied – just. Frankly, I was disappointed that so few women ran for either position.

  And, to correct Colin on one minor point, the Party’s entitlement to ALDE Council delegates is still linked to national, and not European, election results until such time as a common electoral system is introduced for the European Parliament across the member states. What happens in 2016 is entirely unknown – something I intend to address as a newly elected member of IRC.

• JohnTilley 22nd Nov '14 - 12:07pm

  Simon 22nd Nov ’14 – 9:12am
  Thanks for the confirmation that the Federal Executive has 29 members, 14 of whom do not come from this election.

  Can I request that the full list of all 29 who will be voting members of the Federal Executive be published here in LDV?

  It will be quite important to know over the next few months and most ordinary mortals cannot find their way round the labyrinths of mis-information and public relations pap that seems to dominate the party website.

• Tony Rowan-Wicks 22nd Nov '14 - 12:12pm

  It is one thing to be democratic at Party Conference but quite another to engage with the full membership. For example, the names on the above lists mean little to me – as most electd people don’t seem to write on any blog or documents which I read – LD or otherwise [I do recognise a few names]. And I could not vote on some of the party issues put to members as I have never heard of the participants proposed. For the record, I have read much from 4 of those elected and am sure they will stand up for what they say every day on LDV etc.

  I don’t know what the answers to these points could be. One major point I do know is – whatever the principle which elected representatives of all types [those I have read over a long period] are elected upon – there will be a thousand reasons why some don’t stand up for what they said before being elected. Strange deviations include “political imperatives” I’m told. That’s parliamentary language I believe, and it is why many members are not impressed with the resultant fogs [fog is a polite word].

• Tony Rowan-Wicks 22nd Nov '14 - 12:33pm

  I support John Tilley’s request. May we add some information of what the other 14 have done over the last 5 years – which surely influenced their election from some group or other. And will these people please keep contact with all members of the party in an open manner – as our party can do using modern technology.

  p.s. Do we have members elected from those who have fallen from councils? We need their skills and experience to rise again in the party! They are our roots on the doorstep when the centrist advocates are no more.

• Amalric 22nd Nov '14 - 5:14pm

  Federal Executive is:
  The President
  Three Vice Presidents – the heads of the three state parties
  The Leader
  Two MPs
  One Lord
  One MEP
  Two councillors
  Three people elected by the three state parties
  14
  One more than the above number elected by Conference reps

  Policy Committee is:
  The President
  The Leader
  Four MPs
  One Lord
  One MEP
  Three Councillors
  Three people elected by the three state parties
  14
  One more than the above number elected by Conference reps

  Conference Committee is:
  The President
  Chief Whip or MP appointed by the Chief Whip
  Three people elected by the three state parties
  Two people elected by Federal Executive Committee
  Two people elected by the Federal Policy Committee
  Two members of staff who can’t vote
  9 (11)
  12 people elected by Conference reps

• Duncan Brack 22nd Nov '14 - 5:32pm

  Mark – thanks very much for teaching me to count! You are absolutely right, both IRC and ALDE fulfilled the one third quota without needing to adjust the outcome. However, that is the right answer, not Colin’s.

• SIMON BANKS 22nd Nov '14 - 6:24pm

  I found the process gruelling online and it wasn’t very clear if I could do a bit of it, rest and return to it later. That may help to explain the “spoilt ballots”.

• Mark Valladares 22nd Nov '14 - 7:03pm

  @ Simon,

  I agree, it was very gruelling to try and do it all in one session. I ended up leaving the FPC election for a week, having checked that my other votes were ‘banked’, so to speak.

  It would be helpful if, in future, the ability to do it in multiple sessions was made clearer, if by doing so, we could increase participation.

• Jonathan Brown 22nd Nov '14 - 7:42pm

  I agree with both points above. As wasn’t sure if we could leave and come back later, I put off doing it for quite some time. As it turned out, I accidentally got thrown offline and so discovered that I could log in again.

  I think it would also help to send out a form with every ballot email with lists of candidates that allows you to drag and drop into categories. So anyone reading through the manifesto booklet could sort candidates as they went along into ‘definites/top choices’, ‘possibles’ and ‘definitely nots’. You could then drag and drop within each category to get the order right.

  And once you’d done that, you could fill in the actual ballot ‘paper’.

  As it was, if you’d cast your first 10 votes and then found you’d missed someone, there was a big incentive to place them 11th rather than add them in the right order, and then amend all of your previous choices.

• Mark Valladares 22nd Nov '14 - 11:03pm

  @ Jonathan,

  An interesting thought, but I suspect that we all have different approaches to the task. I tend to draw up a written list, start by eliminating people who simply don’t submit a manifesto or whose manifesto annoys me, then pick out candidates that impress me or whose performance I believe to be worthy of re-election. The rest, I apply the advice that someone I deeply respect gave me – not doing something can, in itself, be a deliberate act – and vote on the basis of perceived value, or not at all.

  We all have different ways of doing it, and the more tech savvy amongst us can use technology to aid them. So a prescriptive means of deciding might be as off-putting to some as it would be attractive to others.

• Nick Barlow 23rd Nov '14 - 8:07am

  I think the limit comes from the ERS technology which uses the drop-down menus for voting. I’ve found voting in preferential ballots online a lot easier with the click and drag style that some of the LDV surveys have used. Perhaps the party (as a client) ought to be asking ERS to look into other ways of running the ballot online.

• Jonathan Brown 23rd Nov '14 - 5:56pm

  @Nick and Mark – this is exactly what I’m getting at. A drag and drop menu would be much easier than what we had. If the ERS platform can’t handle it, then a form sent out with the ballot paper that allowed you to drag and drop candidates into your preferred order prior to you then copying the results across into the actual form would be helpful.

  Of course, no one would have to use a separate form, and there’s nothing wrong with using a pen and paper to make lists, but having moved to online voting I don’t think it would be a bad idea to give voters another tool to help them organise their thoughts and their votes.

• Annedenise Diamond 24th Nov '14 - 10:32am

  Why have this conversation the members vote for who they wanted why take it to heart just try next time to gather more votes

  Wish those who made it well done, its now up to you to give a go

• JohnTilley 25th Nov '14 - 11:38am

  Amalric many thanks for this information. Can you or anyone provide the names of the people who fulfil these roles?
  I know the name of the MEP (that was easy!), I also know the name of the leader(well for the time-being) and I will know the name of the new President in a few days — but who are all the others?

  For example who is the “head of the state party” for those of us who live in England?
  Who are the “…Three people elected by the three state parties..”?

  Amalric 22nd Nov ’14 – 5:14pm
  Federal Executive is:
  The President
  Three Vice Presidents – the heads of the three state parties
  The Leader
  Two MPs
  One Lord
  One MEP
  Two councillors
  Three people elected by the three state parties
  14
  One more than the above number elected by Conference reps

• Amalric 27th Nov '14 - 2:52am

  @ John Tilley

  For the current year you can go to the party website to see who the 29 people are –
  http://www.libdems.org.uk/federal_executive

  Hopefully it will be updated before the Christmas holidays or very soon after New Year’s Day for those on it for 2015.

  It would a really good if there was a much more informative English party web page that included the members of all the English committees and English reps to Federal committees. I would also like to see reports of English Council meetings as well, but maybe that is just wishful thinking.

  The Welsh party has its own website – http://welshlibdems.org.uk/en/
  But I couldn’t see a list of members of the Welsh committees and the Welsh reps to Federal committees.

  The Scottish party has its own website – http://www.scotlibdems.org.uk/
  But I couldn’t see a list of members of the Scottish committees and the Scottish reps to Federal committees.

• JohnTilley 27th Nov '14 - 8:08am

  Amalric — that is really helpful, thank you. What a pity that the powers that be do not automatically provide links to such info.
  Amalric 27th Nov ’14 – 2:52am
  http://www.libdems.org.uk/federal_executive
  I completely agree with you that–.
  It would a really good if there was a much more informative English party web page that included the members of all the English committees and English reps to Federal committees and also reports of English Council meetings as well.

  Perhaps some of those recently elected or re-elected could comment here that they will make sure it happens?