2 big stories
Was it a political choice by the Government not to take part in the EU joint procurement scheme, as Sir Simon McDonald originally suggested, or not, as his subsequent “clarification” indicated? To be honest, it probably doesn’t matter, as you can get different answers from different members of the Cabinet anyway. And, even if you got a consistent answer, can you believe very much that comes out of this Government in any event?
Matt Hancock’s further clarification, that they did join the EU scheme, was almost immediately, and inevitably, denied by a European Union spokesperson, as reported by the Guardian. The word “shambles” is probably too kind, given that people are dying because of it.
Meanwhile, HMRC is calmly getting on with the job of distributing vast sums of money via the Job Retention Scheme, having trained thousands of staff on how the scheme works and now put them to work answering telephone enquiries and staffing a webchat system. Never let it be said that the Civil Service can’t move quickly when it needs to do so.
2 social media posts
I always find Nick Barlow to be a most thoughtful Liberal, even if his conclusions make uncomfortable reading sometimes. Yesterday’s contribution was no exception, as he questions whether the Liberal Democrats actually have a future…
The issue for the Liberal Democrats is that I see too many people assuming that the end of this will see a reversion back to the political norm. (It’s possibly the same politics-as-modern-nostalgia mindset that thought stopping Brexit would mean everything going back to early 2015 again) I’ve even seen people arguing that post-Coronavirus will be the perfect time for a party of “centrist moderation” to have its moment, because there are some bad political ideas that simply will not die no matter how many times the electorate give them a thorough killing.
He’s right, I fear, in that no political party has a divine right to survive.
Munira Wilson is crowdsourcing a question for Matt Hancock today. If you have any suggestions, and do keep them polite, you know what to do…
So tomorrow, for the first time in 4 weeks, Matt Hancock will make a statement to the House of Commons on #COVID19. I will be joining remotely to ask him a question. So many issues, I'm only allowed one question. Any suggestions out there Twittersphere?
— Munira Wilson MP 🇺🇦 (@munirawilson) April 21, 2020
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22 Comments
Did we or didn’t we? It’s all a bit academic by now. Whether it’s ventilators or face masks, we appear to want to go our own way. Just like we did back in the 1950s when we could have joined the EEC and been one of the original signatories of the Treaty of Rome. Even the Suez fiasco didn’t appear to register with those politicians who still reckoned that we were a world power, and happened to be running the show at the time. Perhaps they no longer subscribe to the League of Empire Loyalists; but their political descendants are still amongst us and generally thriving in the ranks of the eurosceptics.
It all reminds me of what David Niven said about his erstwhile co tenant of what they christened ‘Cirrhosis by the Sea’, one Errol Flynn. “You always knew where you were with Errol. He always let you down”. That’s how I often feel about our governments of all colours! I’m sure that those Coalition haters will agree with me, and I admit that they have a point.
I guess another way of looking at this EU joint procurement scheme, is that it is part of a legacy of 40 years of competencies we [UK], have exported to the EU?
Basically the UK have handed more and more incremental competencies (a.k.a. sovereignty!), to the EU, and as a result have run down our ability to deal with some uk national issues at the uk national level. Taking back control means the exact opposite of that, and so by repatriating competencies, which means that we have to re-engage with the processes of managing our own competencies, as any other sovereign agency would.
Covid-19 has been a shock to that whole system of EU joint competencies at the Brussels level, and they have failed badly. Any loose imaginings of an EU being a sharing organisation in a crisis, has been blasted out of the water as Italy’s pleas for PPE help was given the German ‘middle finger’.
Tomorrow Thursday 23rd April, we will find out just how stable the EU, the Eurozone, and ultimately the Euro reality, compares with the fantasy EU dream?
Whether we joined this EU joint procurement scheme or not, for sure it was a failure, because the ‘EU initiative’ has provided no net benefit to the leaving UK, and more importantly any EU member country. So joining it or not joining it made no material difference.
Moreover the EU/ECB financial decisions (Thursday), will provide a stark reality to every EU member, who will find that sharing the good times isn’t matched by a commitment to share the bad times.
This crisis is accelerating the collapse of EU-nity, and is proving that the EU is nothing more than a cardboard Potemkin dream, and the UK was right to go its own way.
@Dilettante Eye – “Covid-19 has been a shock to that whole system of EU joint competencies at the Brussels level, and they have failed badly.”
I think it has been a shock to entire modern political system, globally and the evidence is that in general in most countries it has failed badly. In the UK it has further exposed just how dependent we’ve become to vulnerable global supply chains, which we willing built over the decades; because they helped to make us rich.
Westminster’s failure to join the EU scheme and/or make a timely start on sensible alternative arrangements, is wholly down to Westminster and Westminster alone.
Whist we sit around doing nothing latest YouGOv has us at 5%!!!!!
Mark’s passing comment about the limited credibility of this government is a salutary reminder at this stage. The present Head of Government (like his US counterpart) is in a different league when it comes to the lying game in comparison with his predecessors and I would hope that John Marriott makes the distinction. We may have had big issues with Theresa May, David Cameron or, for that matter the Coalition. EU or no EU, it is inevitable that such leadership is going to come with instability and danger. This is no time for letting up on the exposure of government weaknesses.
and the Tories on 53% despite their obvious incompetence.
“Redfield & Wilton Strategies” (no, me neither) has us on 8%, unchanged on last time — and the Tories on 52%. Our ratings seem to be affected much more by pollster methodology than those of the larger parties.
The Tories are benefiting from a ‘crisis bounce’, as governing parties tend to do in a crisis not of their own making. Even the change in Labour leadership doesn’t seem to have affected the polls. So opinion polls are meaningless until some semblance of politics as usual returns, and it’s possible for politicians other than government spokespeople to get a decent media hearing. They are also meaningless until we start having elections again.
The first duty of a Liberal is surely to tell the truth & as far as possible, the Whole truth.
Since the Election we have seen One Poll putting us on 5% but we have also seen Polls giving us 6%, 7%, 8%, 9%, 10% & 11%. Currently we are probably around 8% which isnt bad when you consider that the Government/Tories are taking more than half the Vote.
This is an odd time when people can clap for the NHS & “Vote” for the Tories. What the Voters are doing is rallying round the Government who just happen to be Tories. Its temporary & we have no idea what the Voters will think as we emerge from the first stage of this crisis. Its more than a Year till anyone actually casts a real Vote. By that time we will be well into the second stage of the Covid crisis, mass unemployment & possibly, Deflation.
Dilettante Eye wonders if the EU will survive. It does seem to be entering a triple crisis with its economy, credibility and political purpose being challenged.
Others are concerned about the continuing poor performance of this party in the polls. It is not surprising. The party is leaderless and currently pointless. The public wonders if Revoke is still the Flagship policy. Some members think it should be.
I have been surprised and perplexed by the high frequency of posts and comments that dwell on the ideology, history and values of liberalism. Why should that be surprising on a Lib Dem site, I hear you ask. Perhaps I should not be surprised, but I see it as introspection, navel gazing, Liberal Geek Speak. It is reinforcing behaviour, it is comforting. It gives pleasure that the site community is singing to the liberalism hymn sheet.
But then, at this phase in the political cycle, the party should be looking at policies to attract the non-initiated, the non-believers, the ordinary voters who are not devoted to conservatism, socialism or liberalism but crave for common sense policies and honest politicians. It may be time to leave the comfort zone and think hard about what is the role of the party in the real world, where voters don’t have time to ponder on whether Locke or anyone else would have approved.
‘Did we or didn’t we’
Who cares, the EU tender has so far delivered zero in terms of Ventilators & PPE.
In the meantime we have solved our ventilator problem in-house & a family relative working on the front line in France tell us they have been told to expect additional ventilators from this tender in July.
The only benefit of participating in the EU tender would be if they could jump the already massive queue, I wouldn’t want to be a party to that.
Dear Dilettante Eye,
The attitude that we have given up things to the EU is fatuous. Only if you do not balance this with the enormous number of advantages we have got from membership of the block. Which far out-weight any negatives. We simply need tolearn thelesson in how to be a contributor as well as a receiver. And we need to do it fast before we end on Dec 2020.
Or better we shake ourselves down and re-join the EU, forget the abberation we have been though, and be a proper contributor
Antony, giving away the ability to govern ourselves as an independent nation is what was fatuous, not to mention having to pay a fortune every day to help fund most of the other member states. Admittedly, we did receive shed loads of regulation.
The people used the last election to make their views crystal clear. I don’t think we shall rejoin the EU any time soon.
Dear Antony
We just had a ‘Get Brexit Done’ general election, and Brexit won the democratic mandate.
Sorry it wasn’t what you wanted, but it’s what the majority wanted. You should be pleased as a Liberal Democrat, that democracy is working?
Dear Dilettante Eye – “We just had a ‘Get Brexit Done’ general election, and Brexit won the democratic mandate.”
That s pre-CoViD19 history; currently, the UK is leaving the EU at the end of the year.
what CoViD19 has demonstrated is that the idea that the UK can “go it alone” in the world is delusional. As Anthony pointed out, the UK outside the EU, will have to quickly learn to how to be both an active contributor and a receiver; this pandemic has shown that so far the UK isn’t a quick learner or a quick mover…
Just one point to illustrate the challenge, the UK missed not only joining the EU purchasing scheme, as a recipient but also encouraging UK-based businesses to join up as suppliers of product…
Roland
“That s pre-CoViD19 history; currently, the UK is leaving the EU at the end of the year. “
To be factual, the UK has already left the EU.
Having left, we are a third country, which is why we can negotiate a deal in this transition period, and that period ends on the last day of December 2020, irrespective of whether we have a negotiated deal or not. The EU is desperate for a deal, and it needs to hurry with only 8 months to go.
What CoViD19 has demonstrated is that EU solidarity is ephemeral, and Italy just got thrown under a bus again to save German and Dutch taxpayers.
Maybe reality hasn’t hit yet, but I’m convinced that you will thank leavers one day for saving Britain from the slow motion car-crash that this ill considered EU project is turning into.
@ DE,
I’m not so sure that the European Union is as desperate for a deal as your “they need us more than we need them” stance suggests. A far greater proportion of our exports go to them than of theirs to us, making the adjustment rather easier for them. But you know that already, it’s just that admitting it rather undermines your sanguinity.
Perhaps what recent events have shown is that the European Union is not the federal superstate that you and your friends accused it of being, and that individual member states had rather more sovereignty than you pretended they had.
But it seems that it’s not enough for you to want Britain to succeed – and I credit you with wanting that, even as I disagree with you about what is better for our country going forward – you have to see others fail too.
It’s that sort of attitude that will make building new relationships going forward that much more difficult. Vote Dilettante Eye for a Britain hostile to other countries, smaller, pettier, and lonelier!
Mark Valladares
My hope is that the 27 European nations come to the same conclusion as British voters and realise that the EU is at best a fair-weather friend and that they survive and thrive and trade individually with a currency which better suits their individual requirements.
And as a bonus, they too will be free of this this creeping malevolent EU project which NO European citizen ever voted for in the first place ! , and the …EU project …, finally gets consigned to the dustbin of history.
Support Europe and Europeans YES,.. EU? .. NO
Can’t make it any clearer?
P.S. When it comes to the issue of desperate for trade, I note that in this recent crisis there were no, 2metre queues outside BMW dealerships?
” come to the same conclusion as British voters”…… Errrrr. No.
It may have escaped Dilly Little England’s notice, but there is a very different opinion north of Berwick and Carlisle.
David Raw
I think an independentScotland needs to work out what currency it intends to use first, because they couldn’t realistically expect the Dilly Little Bank of England to underwrite independent Scottish Banks if they got into trouble?
Indeed if Sturgeon did try to use the £, I suspect canny Scots would do most of their banking over the border in England, where the first £75,000 is protected by the BoE.
Dilettante Eye Dodging and weaving again yet again. I said nothing about Scottish independence – you introduced it.
Obviously you don’t care about inflicting your version of Little Englanderism on people who by a majority of 62-38 voted a different way. Now you threaten economic consequences. Fine democrat you are.
By the way it’s not the best of manners to address our very competent First Minister by her surname, but then I don’t suppose you know any better.
@Mark, the EU controls almost every competence apart from health and sport (though within health it does control employment law, pharmaceuticals, clinical protocols, equipment specifications, body implants and much more.) You can bet that after this the EU will want to micromanage every aspect of health.
However, the pandemic does expose EU problems that will be more difficult to solve. As in the migrant crisis, the people of Europe look to their national governments, leaving EU politicians as impotent observers. The EU likes to act as a superstate and regards nationalism as its enemy, but the people of Europe will never embrace the Commission as representatives of their homelands especially at time of crisis.
Ministers too, are unwilling to embrace the project fully and cannot bring themselves to commit to the sharing of debts. The same fudge gets repeated every time. The ECB spends billions but the questions of who will pay for it and does anyone have to pay it back, get brushed under the carpet for another day.
These and other flaws are central to the whole experiment. Once great countries like Germany and France are now lacking in confidence, direction and stability as well as stagnating financially. One wonders whether a slow decline will cause more long term damage than a quick implosion.
David Raw
We use Corbyn, Trump, Hancock, Benn, Trudeau, as a clear identifiers, so I don’t see how Sturgeon is disrespectful?
“Now you threaten economic consequences”
It’s not me who threatens economic consequences, I simply point out that the SNP haven’t thought through what independence means for the notes in Scottish purses and wallets.
Is it threatening to point out the obvious, that an independent Scotland (as a third country) using the £ is not just ridiculous but defeats the point of independence, given that its independent finances, would in no way come under the protective umbrella of a Bank of England?
If you were alluding to our EU membership, then Scotland, Wales N.Ireland and England voted in the 2016 referendum as a United Kingdom, and the result of those united votes were clearly for Brexit.
Democracy isn’t the pick n mix that you clearly desire?
@Dilettante Eye – I think you are blinded by your obsession with “the EU” bogeyman and have totally missed the ball.
Whilst whatever happens in Brussels will have an impact on the UK economy, the big issue is what is the UK doing; as the only way for the Brexiteers to receive the thanks they crave is to be active in building the new UK – so far there is little evidence of Leavers getting out of their armchairs and grasping with both hands the opportunities they claim are there for the taking…